freeze plays.........sat

dr. freeze

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Tor +2.5
Raptors are the better team. i think this is the year that the Jazz finally collapse and hope to take advantage of it before the linesmakers do......will be playing against them more often than not and today is no exception

Charlotte -9 POD
nuff said.....fading the bulls....plus charlotte played well against the spurs and should be up for this one after losing a close one two nights ago......bulls imploding on and off the court....Oakley is a cancer for this team and he should not be there.....

Nets -10.5 Nets are playing well right now....especially at home.....Cavs suck, and have a really hard time scoring.....don't see them keeping up with the Nets

Golden State......knicks had a tough loss last night blowing a huge lead and travelling back to NY while the Golden state picked up some confidence with a win -- shorter travel to NY.....i will take the points.....game looks to be close
 

jderrida

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Dr. Freeze, I guess you are right about those trends:

IND 8-1 ATS when on a 3 game SU and ATS winning streak....COVERED

CHICAGO 9-1 ATS at home after a double-digit away loss....COVERED

NJ is 1-8 ATS at home vs CLEVELAND....CLEV COVERED

I won't post anymore trends if you think it will help you isolate better games...
JD
smile.gif
 

dr. freeze

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those trends have nothing to do with the current teams though jderrida....read this....Nolan put it up and it is excellent.....
"WHEN GOOD TRENDS GO BAD"

One thing I've spent some time investigating is the application of TRENDS in NFL handicapping. It's critical that we weed-out trends that are completely worthless (which sadly, constitutes the overwhelming majority of trends which are posted in the linesheets) -- versus trends which might actually be useful (which are few and far between).

For instance, here's a trend to think about: The Dallas Cowboys are now 15-3 ATS in home games played in October, since 1996. Does anyone think this "trend" has any significance whatsoever? Of course not! 90 percent of this team's personnel was not around in the years 1996, 1997, and so on. How about the trend that the Kansas City Chiefs are just 1-13 ATS in games against the AFC East? Again -- more worthless junk.

Question: Does anyone think that Chiefs' players actually say to themselves, "We're really screwed this week -- we have to play the Patriots." These trends that are published in all the top sports gambling magazines are just total rubbish. Ignore them.

What about trends where one team has dominated another historically? Actually, the LONGER such a trend continues, the more inclined I am to BET AGAINST IT. For instance, Pittsburgh had lost 7 straight games to Tennessee before the MNF game two weeks ago. What I looked at was the fact the Steelers had played the Titans in two extremely tough games last season (losses of 2 and 3 points respectively). They were playing on Monday Night Football in a huge home game against the banged-up Titans. Tampa Bay had lost a 678,359 straight games at Green Bay. Oakland had lost 11 of 12 to the Broncos. What I believe happens is this -- players start getting tired of hearing all the smack that TEAM A can't beat TEAM B. So, an additional motivation factor gradually surfaces. When an athlete is motivated, that's always a positive development. Conversely, teams that have dominated recent history may start to feel complacent. "Ah, what the hell -- we beat these turkeys the last 9 straight games." That's the mentality.

Of course, Pittsburgh did beat Tennessee. Tampa covered easily in Green Bay. And, Oakland snapped the bad streak against Denver on Monday night. I admit this is SELECTIVE data analysis for just the last week or so. But the point is -- winning or losing streaks really don't mean that much in the NFL with all the changing rosters, revolving coaching staffs, inconsistent motivations, and player injuries.

One point: I DO place added emphasis on trends as they relate to betting TOTALS. If two teams traditionally play close, low-scoring games I am inclined to give that some weight in upcoming games. Players NEVER say to themselves "Since we went OVER the last 6 games, let's try to go UNDER this week." But they do use trends as a motive to break long losing streaks. I think if two teams have a history of producing either high or low scoring games -- that same tendency carries over in the next contest to a certain extent. Of course, this is purely situational and you have to look at many other factors.

One final point: There are hundreds of trends out there about playing a team in such-and-such situation. Some sound very convincing. Here's a great example taken from yesterday's Message Forum:

CountZero is the author of the following: "You're putting yourself in a potentially bad situation if you don't look at the whole story on these angles. Whoever developed them just cut off the record at whatever year produced the most convincing numbers. Look at one?.TEAMS OFF A SU AND ATS WIN IN A DIVISIONAL ROAD GAME ON MNF -- the record is listed as 16-8 since 1997. Why 1997? Did something happen in 1997 to change the nature of MNF, or of teams that win an important game? Were there some important rule changes in the NFL in 1997? No. The reason the angle starts in 1997 is because from 1983 to 1996 this system went 33-42 (44 percent). The real record through last week is 51-50, purely random. This is true of almost every angle you see printed. Hope anyone who relies on this approach to handicapping will do themselves a favor and track down the true historical record before betting."

CONCLUSION: Some trends are very useful in handicapping. I'll stick with one of the most reliable and well-known -- playing a Monday Night home dog: That trend is 110-56 since 1970. The reasons why this is a strong play are obvious (although the trend is not nearly as powerful as it once was -- since linesmakers have caught on to the trend and made adjustments over the years, thus decreasing the line value). There are many others, which are explainable by applying logic. Letdown theories, inner-division rivalries, and so forth. As a general rule, if it's a trend that can be explained in a logical and systematic fashion, I think it's worth looking at -- meaning you should then see if stands the test of time (go back as far as possible). If the basis of the trend defies human explanation -- it's probably rubbish and will not help you pick winners.


that being said, i hope you won with your picks and always hope you do, but i want to make sure i expose bad handicapping and tried to BEFORE you make you bet so that you make the right call.....turns out you were right tonight so congrats....i was wrong....but solid handicapping in the end ALWAYS prevails and i am trying to get better at it and so are you too so i would appreciate if you give me insight and i will share with you mine.....

as for my picks today....
i picked 4 games with 2 dogs....all four teams won with only 2 covering...not too happy about this.....have been hot with the favs lately though so i guess it is about time i get some that don't cover.....

i guess Chi was pissed about the whoopin they took and probably played with some fire....shouldda taken that into account and passed but was 3-0 fadin em so far and liked the single digit line against a top tier east team....i don't know what happened in NJ as i didn't expect that one to be close at all.....

Golden State whipped the Knicks who have already melted down, and remember my prediction: look for Van Grundy to be out of there by at least just after the all star break......Tor. took it to the Jazz as i see everything has a time to live and a time to die and the success of the Jazz is gonna die and in a year or two this franchise will win 20 games.....
 

jderrida

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DR. FREEZE:

I did take some umbrage against you as I thought your comment was negatively slanted
and aimed in a pejorative manner at my querry, but I appreciate your reply nevertheless. I feel that dialogue is the most important aspect (not over analysis of a game or total), but good dialogue and proper triangulation of methodology in handicapping. I admit, I use
trends, but I am very selective about which trends to use (I didn't have the balls to play CHIC tonight +10, and I would have gone the other way if someone had a gun pointed at my head), but they do provide a superficial screening when one is initially looking for value out there. I am not into betting football as I have really never been interested in the sport from a betting stand-point, but your examples are well documented and make common as well as statistical sense.

Situational methodology is an important aspect of capping games, I agree, because playing games on a trend-only basis is dangerous, but using trends in conjunction with other important dialogue is necessary to beat that 52.38% hurdle. I did take the PACERS tonight and it was my only play, but I was not telling anyone else, like Raymond, that POR was a bad bet; I just wanted to see how he or anyone got a conclusion that POR had value. Overall, I knew that Indy has played many games in a row and that could lead to fatigue, but, I also knew that I. Thomas intentionally spread out starter minutes to avoid fatigue tonight. POR is one of my favorite teams, but they just don't have chemistry right now and their new coach has yet to construct a line-up that consistently can compete on the road. I also think that loosing Sabonis hurts the team. They are much younger this
year and that could be an issue for them especially on the road. Taking that into
consideration, I wasn't betting for IND, but rather against POR,and sometimes that is a
better way to cap a gameI do appreciate your response as I think that our dialogue is the
most important rather than our differences in selection. Thus, combined with situational
knowelge coupled with some strong trends, I did like the play.

Anyway, I don't bet football, but your examples are well taken, so I can imagine that the reliability of a trend might vary in each sport respectively. I have found that trends in the NBA can be useful indicators when trying to find value out there. I don't bet more than
2-3 plays week, so I try to capitalize on games which have significant value. BOS was the other play, and although they covered, it wasn't easy because none of this is easy, but with helpful dialogue, making predictions becomes a bit easier.

I wish you the best and I never meant to criticize any plays you may have won/lost, I just wanted to express what little knowledge I may contribute here. I look forward to a
profitable NBA season, and I hope that we may communicate more in the future.

PS: SORRY FOR THE BAD CROP....

[This message has been edited by jderrida (edited 11-11-2001).]
 

dr. freeze

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don't be sorry....i appreciate all your help....thanks and hope i can help you too in the future.......cool.....late
 

dr. freeze

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another factor i failed to realize in the Bulls/Char. game was the fact that Eddie Robinson was going against his former teammates.....usually guys think about this game all offseason and want to play really well in it.....since it takes game and competitiveness to make it to this level, more often than not, the guy plays well with a lot of heart (when he wants to).....missed a couple big factors in this one that there is no excuse for not seeing......
 
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