McCLINE vs KLITSCHO....FINAL THOUGHTS.

[SMOKE JENSEN]

Well I'm thru pondering. My first gut instinct was upset. I've tried to shake that. But in the end i can't shed it. So with that in mind here is how I see the fight going.

I believe WK will find JM harder to impose his will on. Also I still believe this is WK's hardest test to date. While WK is very offensively sound. I believe this fight we will see if he is good at taking a punch from a very big heavyweight. I believe WK will start out very fast. But I think he will be discouaged how his punches are not having dramatic affect on JM. Somewhere say from the 3rd round or so JM will start to connect. WK will start to swell and come away with a few abrasions. His skin dose not seem to be very durable. Then we'll get to see what's deep in the tank of WK. I'm just not convinced & sold on WK. I love the way he carries himself in and out of the ring. Just don't know if he can handle it when the going gets rough. And I believe it will get tough. I'm calling for a McCLINE upset.

 

[gardenweasel]

i`m gonna weigh in tomorrow

i`m gonna weigh in tomorrow

got spanked with a furnace failure during a 9 inch snowfall in baltimore...i will say,that i believe smoke`s analysis is pretty damned sound.....the first few rounds are critical to mccline if he is to have a shot...will wlad blow mccline out,or,will we get to see whether klitschko has the heart and stamina to go some hard late rounds vs a big,athletic foe?.......i`m honestly excited about this one ...many questions will be answered saturday....g.l.

 

[badjab]

Klitschko is a much more disciplined fighter than some of the other big guys his size (Golata comes to mind). Plus, he hits like he has horseshoes in his gloves. If you can knock out Ray Mercer, that says something. 39-1 (36 KO's). One of the only guys he hasn't left on the canvas is Chris Byrd -- but he did win the decision. I think he will control this fight and get his knockout between rounds 5-7.

I ended up playing a parlay with Klitschko and Mayweather at 1-2.

 

[UT-Longhorn]

Well guys, I wish you luck, but I think your bettin on the loser. McCline is inexperienced, not a single amateur bout, and it shows in the ring.

McCline has been knocked out once, in the 1st round, his second fight, almost 7 years ago. His last three fights have been against big name has-beens, and never-has-beens (M. Grant, tko 1st round). When I think of McCline, I think of a lazy, underachiever who will never take control of his postion in life (if I was a prize fighter, you think I'd dink around for a u. decision?)

Now lets look at Wlad. 39 wins 36 via kayo. Need I say more? His last five fights, four have been ko's. Mercer 6, Mercer has never been knocked down in his career, first round with Wlad, he's down, Botha 8, Shufford 6, Jefferson 2, down 3 times, and Chris Byrd UD, Byrd knocked down twice. Yeah, most has beens, but tough none the less. My $$$ is on Wlad, but I wish yall the best of luck! Thats what I love about wagering, atleast one of us will win

 

[SMOKE JENSEN]

Just opinions. Not betting. I do not think Mercer is a legitimate argument. He was nothing more than a 40 year old plus punching bag. Way past his prime. Not a good measuring stick. Other than the undersized Byrd. I cannot find anybody legit on WK ledger. By the way. The undersized and light hitting Byrd went the the full distance. Some food for thought. And while were bringing up McCLINE'S knockout early in his career. Let's not for WK loss to Ross Purity. The utilmate journeyman. WK quit. Looking forward to Sat. night. As always. I enjoy the exchanging of thoughts.

 

[ferdville]

I look at it in a slightly different way. If WK can connect early in the fight (1-3) and hurt JM, I look for WK to come close to throwing a shut out or post a knock out. In my opinion, the first 3 rounds will dictate the end of the fight. I agree that there are some questions about WK's will and heart. But, he is no imposter with the record he has. If he has some success in the early rounds, I see a relentless attack and a pretty good pounding coming JM's way. What will happen if the initial rounds go JM's way? That is when it should get real interesting.

 

[gardenweasel]

guys

guys

you seem very confident betting on klitscko....and there`s a reason....he`a 5-1 favorite(although the odds have dropped since i wagered at +480 on mccline)...this guy is considered the next dominant heavyweight by most people...and this very well may happen....my take is this....the derrick jefferson`s,the shuffords,botha.....these guys are not the cream of the heavyweight crop....for that matter,neither is goofi whittaker or shannon briggs....both guys wins over byrd and michael grant are noteworthy...and you can rationalize both wins...byrd is ridiculously small to be fighting guys like the klitschko`s....hard to outbox guys when you can`t get within arms reach of them....and mccline happened to catch grant on the rebound off the disappointing lewis loss........i stiill feel there are numerous questions to be answered here...can mccline stand up to a very talented,heavy punching wlad?is mccline`s chin for real,or was the k.o. early in his career an indication of a weakness?.....is wlad the next great heavyweight,or was the "give-up" vs puritty an indication of a lack of toughness?.this has happened to both brothers...that is a legit concern when you`re laying over 5-1..my big question regarding wlad came in the mercer fight....mercer is 40 years old.....40 YEARS OLD....i think he averaged around 15-20 punches per round...that`s what happens to an old,shot fighter...he can`t get off....but,what i noticed was that most of mercer`s punches were jabs....and they they weren`t overwhelming and all didn`t land....but wlad was pretty well marked up after the fight....along comes reasonably light punching mccline(probably why he was selected)....but,he is 6`6"....the same height as klitschko...he actually outweighs wlad by 25 pounds(240 to 265)...mccline,although not a particularly heavy puncher,is an excellent jabber...and since that early career k.o.,has not been stopped....it also seems that since mccline beat grant,his career has changed and so has his confidence...he is not a k.o. guy,but is used to going the distance with big,harder punching heavies(briggs and whittaker)....he is more of a counter puncher and seems to have a fairly good defense(and he is a very athletic big man)....


klitschko has oodles of talent....there can be no denying that...but,is he really ,really tough(he may not need to be)?.....will he break up(facially)vs a huge man with a very stiff jab....what will happen if mccline survives the first 4 or 5 rounds and things aren`t going wlad`s way?mccline is on a roll...just received the new jersey fighter of the year award(or something).....

more than likely,wlad`s talent will prevail(speed,power,talent....a big edge)....would i lay 5 to 1 odds......absolutely not...i see to many potential pitfalls here...i will gladly take a shot with my +480 here.....and i really believe i have a shot.....i am outgunned talent-wise..... but,i just may have the tougher,hungrier guy who knows he has to take wlad into the deep water to have a shot....i also think that if mccline holds on early,wlad`s face could be a problem....


if mccline`s people send him out to punch with wlad,we will go home early,and you guys can collect....i like the long odds and am taking the shot at a nice sized payday.....i couldn`t watch the fight if i had the balls to lay the 5 to 1....i`d have trouble laying 5-1 on christy martin vs mia st covergirl....and that`s an absolute bag shot..

you don`t win very often with 5-1 shots....i`ll roll the dice.....g.l. guys(especially smoke.... )...

 

[SMOKE JENSEN]

As usual. Nice informative post GW. Goodluck to you. Hope you hit that big payday.:grins:

 

[TheShrimp]

GW is right here. It should be a Klitschko win, its just a matter if you want to lay the 5-1.

I don't like laying much, but I'm puttin some on VK. The thing that I think comes out here is simply that I'm a firm believer in experience. VK has a ton of it. McCline has none of it.

JM had 1 amateur fight. ONE. VK had tons (I could find a number) including winning the Olympics. I suspect VK to throw stuff at JM that he's never seen. JM is just another in the line of great big athletes that different trainers have tried to take to the heavyweight title. They all get just so far, and then run into a guy like Klitschko.

Take a guy like Byrd, on the other hand, who had 275 amateur fights, and a run in the olympics. He went 12 with VK and beat Tua. That guy is a real fighter, and probably the best test of VK's heart and talent. And VK cleaned him out.

Saturday night, Jameel McCline in going to be in a world he doesn't understand. And the broken ankle win against Grant, the decisions against GOON GOOFi and washed up Briggs didn't teach him enough. Between pros and amateurs, he's had 33 fights. [edit : 34. 1 am, 33 pro]

6-1 is a lot to lay, but sometimes that's what you have to do in betting the fight game. I can't really criticize taking the +480 here, either.

Let's say I would be very VERY surprised to see this even be close.

VK by KO in 4.

 

[ferdville]

Good point about WK looking very red after his easy dance versus Mercer. Don't remember if Mercer even landed enough punches to cause it. But his face was nicked a little.

 

[SMOKE JENSEN]

Congrats to all Klitscho backers. He looked very good. Hope he goes all the way.

 

[gardenweasel]

i knew

i knew

i was in trouble when mccline was dancing around,short arming his jabs in the first round....he was scared to death....very disappointing....no wonder mccline didn`t allow an interview after the fight....if that was me,i`d be mortified....i`ll never understand why,you go through all the training,you have a great opportunity,and you don`t at least try....pathetic......congrats klitschko bettors.....enjoy the bread...

 

[TheShrimp]

This one reminded me a lot of Lewis-Tua.

And I think it is because VK is that good. He knew he could win this with movement, and "selective aggression". McCline couldn't do anything.

VK didn't have to go in and risk the big KO just to put on a show.

So, Lewis says he'll fight both Klitschkos and Tyson next year, Vitaly then Mike then Vladimir. I hope he still has his heart in it when its Vladimir's turn.

I could see that being a tactical boring fight, though.

Holyfield-Byrd coming up. Haven't seen the lines. Big lean on Byrd, but I've been burned too many times going against The Warrior.

 

[SMOKE JENSEN]

WK is starting to get what Tyson had over so many opponents. That is fear & intimidation before they step into the ring. But Tyson along with how hard he punched talked alot of trash to an opponent before the fight. Can we ever forget the scared look on Bronos face walking in. And that's just to name one. Wk is classy & dosen't talk trash. It's his power and size that dose it. GW is right. Mccline looked like a deer in the headlights. Kudos to WK. I like him very much.

 

[TheShrimp]

WK won't have the intimidation over Lewis. (I'll swtich to Smoke's WK not to confuse with Vitaly. I have seen Vladimir and Wladimir)

Anyway, McCline was same height and out-weighed him by 20 pounds and was scared in there. He realized before the fight (maybe in the first round) that he had no way to beat him.

WK is a scientist and a puncher. Not quite sure what you need to do to beat him. The only way to really beat Lewis was to hopefully sneak in a power punch and catch him off guard (that's how McCall and Rahman did it). Other than that, I don't know how you attack Lewis. I feel the same way with WK. But what it really boils down to is that they're both guys with power that know how to jab and have a huge right to back it up.

WK certainly has taken out anyone they wanted to throw at him. Right now Lewis looks like the only guy that might have a shot at him.

WK did have the fight where he tired, but that seems to be behind him. He went 12 with Byrd, and looked stronger as this bout went along.

Sometimes he paws (like Lewis) and I still haven't seen what kind of heart he has if he was decked. A bout with Lewis would be very very interesting.

Quick note: They talk about guys with fast rhythm (Joe Frazier) and slow rhythm (Ali). This fight really showed extreme examples of each one. However, McCline didn't seem to use his fast rhythm well. He was just herky jerky, always ready to react, never act. WK used his slow rhythm well, always moving but never jerky. Ready to move, but always coming forward. Always balanced foot position, head movement, good blocks. A real classic boxer.

Now, Joe Frazier was a guy that used fast rhythm well. Bobbing and weaving and getting in. Ali on the other hand was fluid and relaxed. Differing styles for great fights.

HBO was criticizing them for a boring fight, but I really thought WK tried to force the action. He was very offensive in round 9 which the fans booed. A bit cautious maybe, but he could afford to be. I can't wait till he fights someone good.

That's all on this one, I think.