My Take.....

[bear]

Much ado about nothing!

If a man of ability can come here, and over a period of 2 years prove himself a standout moneymaker ...........an above reproach person of honesty..........a person who is always willing to help in any situation............... a friend ....a coach, dietician, provider of colon cleaning advice among other thoughtful contributions.........then God Bless.......If that person finds that his skills are marketable..........He deserves our SUPPORT.....not necessarily financial...but our good wishes and support!!!!

These are our friends and more like family.....Don't have short memories folks.. These are not scammers .....whats wrong with some of you....Most should be able to figure the difference!!!

Lotta real good people here getting up over a non-issue.....or something that shouldnt be one.

I, for one, have nothing but best wishes and respect for Fletcher, Hoops and anyone else who can come here and prove their worth
over time and create a demand for their expertise.........Consultants fresh out of college and stockbrokers do the same everyday (sell their services)......many with precious little ability or experience....

Lighten up folks ....These people are "Aces" and I for one, hope they continue to come here even if they dont throw their games up.....You'll still probably benefit from the advice.

bear

 

[Juice]

Its precisely because they were considered friends that many people here were upset.
Would you like it if someone tried to befriend you only to make money off of you. Not saying that it was premeditated, but it was a bad decision.
Most people don't try to make money from their "friends".

 

[djv]

Bear said very well. But the other side is this. You get many who need the help. You have those to busy too cap there own. You have those who just feel someone else idea is better. You have those who tryed and said I need help. They follow you to there death. Everything is great. Then your told follow me but you pay for the best. I will give you some but not the highest. They don't know what the heck to do. It's almost like setting the mouse trap.
Then we still see or learn there are some nice unit picks coming in.
But knowing the best of the best are being purchased by clients. What are these. One guy told us. No one else I believe did. Now lets say a persons top pick is 3 units. He says im not giving them here any moe you get 1 and 2 only. But now some 3 uints start to pop up. Well he is selling his best to clients. So what are these 3 units play. Maybe just alittle drop down. After all how long do you stay in business if you sell your best. Then turn around and place it free for the world to see. It does not add up. And the trap has gone shut. Not saying anyone wanted it to come down that way. But you got to be blind not to see it looks that way. Hey let anyone who thinks they can sell whatever for money do it. But god darn it don't make it look the way this looks.

 

[fletcher]

if you are talking about me what do you mean by don't make it look that way,i gave out a 5* almost 3-4 times aweek that was a service play and i also gave the other plays that i myself played and if it was a 5* or a tip and i didnot play it i said that i didnot play it and why i didnot. and for the little email asking what i have done in the play off look it up 4-0 last week 1-0-1 yesterday and 2-2 today so 7-2-1 isnot bottom scraps,like i said everything i played i posted except a few tips and i always said why i don't see what the fuk you are talking about. and i was ask to do this this wasnot my idea so i wish you would quit making it look that way.
i don't even know what the hell you are trying to say if you want to say i was trying to set people up or scam people have the fuking balls to say it,because you are dead fuking wrong,if i post a damn pick i post it with every fuking intentions of it fuking winning because i played it,like to know where the fuk you are coming from and don't beat around bush say what you think and i will tell you if thats what it is,you really starting to get under my fuking skin by running your fukin mouth of shit you think that you know but it only what you yhink not what is. so if there is a winning or losing play it was played inless i said i did not for some reason and that was very few times,and because a few people ask me to give them any i got if i liked them or not and they would decide if they wanted to play them. so keep running your damn mouth and try to say that i am baiting people or giving lesser picks because you are out in left field with that one pal.

i really post game for people to follow because i know they do to lose yes thats how i am,well if thats how you really feel then you are one sorry sob that has fooled me for 2 years. you can't get it through your thick fuking skull that i was asked to do this i did not come up with the idea,and at least i said if they didnot make money they didnot pay for it but you failed to read that i guess,you read what you wanted to and went off half cocked like many others calling me a scam and everything else you could and then started to day again,ya find me some scammer that willnot take your money if they don't make you a profit for the week,and that is what i said was their insurence. but to come in for 2 fuking days and accuse me of just throwing out lesser plays that didnot have any work involed really takes the fuking cake,and thats why i said i am glad you werenot coming i was looking forward to you coming but you had to ataack and attack about shit you think not what you know.
sorry jack but i am not going to fuking sit back again today and get accused of things by him or anyone else,and the bottom line is noone was forcing anyone to do anything they didnot want,when did you become god.

 

[BobbyBlueChip]

Don't even waste your time, Fletch. I've read the thing three times and still can't understand it. Must be something lost in the translation.

 

[djv]

BBC it's simple. If someone sells there top picks. They don't turn around and then give them away free. Dont matter who it is. It gets Fletch all bent out of shape when some one says this. But you don't stay in busines to long if you do that. Why the hell pay if there going to show up free anyway. It's easy to understand.
Now if there not the top picks your giveing away free. Well then your paying clients don't care. Simple. Is it not. And Fletch this is nothing to do about you being asked to sell anything here. You said some time ago you were doing that some place. I have no idea where just that you said that. Good for you no problem.

 

[fletcher]

ok now i see what has you in a small fog and i can be calm now thanks for explaing and i will tell you the truth if you want to belive it fine if not cant help that and now that i see what you think i would like to meet you and have you come and have a good time,i think i can explain it to you and am now not upset at you that came out better least the first part didnot read the end just enough to see where it had you wondering.

i would put up 2-4 picks aday and when i had a few 5* i would take 1 from there and post it here because some people couldnot affored it and i understand that but i just took the one i thought was the best and put here and there,a few times i got a late one after i had put up plays at the other place and played it and posted it here and so you got it and they didnot,but i dont know if they would win or not but it was the same play,there is no-way i could give you all the 5* because like you said why should they play.and the 3* and 4* were games that i played and they were not any less just because they were up here,theyhad lot of time spent on them and had real cash,belive me i feel like shit when a play loses because i know people lost money and so did i ,i am use to winning and losing that is the business i am in,but when you know others lost on your play that hurts worse or least me it does,hope that helped you out.and hope you come to party this isnot worth fighting over for people like you and i that have been friends for 2 years+ and i wouldnot want it anyother way,so don't feel that way,it will be fun and this puts closure on the whole thing i think,
have a nice night and lets try to get back on track
your friend
fletcher.

 

[djv]

Fletch my not coming was close to being that before all this happened. Im just stopping there. You will also see in the other tread some remarks that may or may not make you mad as hell again. Only point there is im triying to tell you that you have more power then you know.

 

[fletcher]

no i know where you were coming from now or most of it,i try not to think about power i have enough trouble looking out for me,i left coaching to cut down on stress its ok for us to have different veiws as long as you dont think i was trying to pull a fast one because that was never the case nor would it ever be,if i make a play i want it to win.
have a good night.

 

[ferdville]

This just makes no sense to me. fletcher is the last guy that should take abuse from anybody over the selections he has placed in MJ's. If somebody thinks he is giving them sub-standard plays, well then fade them and run to the window every time if that is what you believe. I can't remember Fletcher ever putting a gun to my head and forcing me to play one of his selections. He puts them out; rates them; what more do people want? He even passes along information from runners that he personally does not bet. Keep in mind that Fletcher also gets e-mails from nuts bitching about his picks when he loses - even if he went 9-1 some jackass would slam him for the one loss. Let's keep this forum an exchange of information. I feel that I can judge the information that I receive and evaluate it for whatever purpose. That is all anybody can ask for. It always comes down to a value judgement - and I see nothing wrong with letting the consumer make his own judgement No one has to read any post unless they choose to read it. I hope we don't lose anybody over this bruhaha. Let's try to keep things in perspective. Good luck to all!

 

[bear]

Well,
I really am gonna puy this away here....cause I think 95% of the people get it.............BUt.........Gotta respond to Juice "most people dont try to make money off their friends" Juice.......do you know a stock broker, a real estate agent, car salesman, people who do nice things for you to get repeat business.....sure you do

And thats ok because if you use them,you believe that they are helping you out and you'll be better off for using their service and you pay their commissions...........Now if you make $, buy low, get a better deal, it was worth it ....and that man is your friend. Now you are happy with the service because the man has proven expertise............THAT YOU HAPPILY PAY FOR........because you have an advantage when you do

Soooooooo....Its ok for honest ......good people...to sell their PROVEN expertise whenever the hell they can.......Still of value??
probably...........just not free

bear

 

[selkirk]

I disagree Bear. The reason I was angered by the events is it went against everything this site has stood for.

This site was about sharing information on how to cap better, sharing thoughts on the game etc. It was not meant to be a glorified tout page, or so I thought.

What made MJ was that you had many great cappers sharing information trying to help each other there was no $50 a week.
Many people who know more about it than me, spent time here helping myself and others with a ton of information.

If someone wants to start a service, fine, you can sell what ever you want I do not care in fact good luck. by posting your picks here you can gain a reputation for being good cappers. it can only help.

that is different however from picking out 3 good cappers and trying to charge the people $50 a week (for each) capper. All of the good cappers that help to build this page and make it great.
it also goes against what this page is (was for) to help the average sport bettor to beat the books.



by the way bear I am tired of hearing a few things about these "services"

1. I should be entitled to the money for all the hard work I do.
if someone wants to pay for a service that is fine, however there are many people who post information here for free, if you need more money 1 picks more winners, 2. bet more on the games. 3. get a job if you cannot do it off gambling.

2. people are going to leave if we do not pay them.
that is to bad but many great cappers have left to set up services and their own web pages in the past, what is new here. this has been going on since this page has started.

as for your idea about the stockbroker, car salesman, I help to run a stock club. When a broker does a presentation it is made clear they cannot sell, if they want they can leave their business cards and if it is requested we will distribute them.

some lose interest after this, that is to bad.

thanks
selkirk

 

[DOGS THAT BARK]

Brother Bear

Don't totally disagree with you but do have one question and that is a question everyone must answer for themselves.
Lets pretend we are the best capper on the block or run the best site on the block. We get kudos after kudos week in and week out which gives a sense of pleasure and great pride.

Now lets say that 50% of forum members take home 25K after taxes.Can't remember what the service was going to cost $50 a capper or $50 for all/week but lets just say its $50 for all.

Now the question: At what point in time is the satisfaction of knowing you done your best and been a great asset to many outweighed by the fact you can divy up over 10% of several familys yearly income and still sleep at night.

The sad part is each capper could hit 60% and the buyers would still lose because of human nature in most.

Now if I have anyone one feeling guilty I'll bail you out. For those that would pay,by their very nature would be paying someone else,and they are much better off in your hands.