Why Ole Hill should not run this country

[Cie]

In will begin to list several reasons n this thread why Hillary (and most Dems ) are not fit to lead US Americans. I am hoping that some of you Dems can help me out. I need to hear the other side of these points. Hell, I may be wrong, and only need a lttle shove in the right, I mean left, direction.

Reason #1:

Ole Hill, like most Dems, speaks of taxing the wealthy to support the poor. That is a bull$hit stance because she really steals from the middle class to support the ppor. She has already admitted that she wants households to pay Social Security tax for their 1st 200K in earnings. If I am not mistaken that number currently stands at 100K. Of course, this really hurts the small business owner. As most of you are aware, self-employed individuals, like myself at times, pay the entirety of the SS tax (over 15%). Why would small businesse owners and middle class 2 income families who earn between 100-200K have to contribute more to social security to aid the poor. Are you dems on this site saying that 100K-200K 2 income families are rich:shrug:

Also, I am interested to hear a Demo's stance on why the removal of the capital gains tax would benefit the middle class? I know that I am part of the middle class, and it would have cost me over $4K last year were my capital gains taxed at income tax levels.

I'll add to this list, but am hoping for input on this one first since for me it is the main problem.

 

[ImFeklhr]

.
She has already admitted that she wants households to pay Social Security tax for their 1st 200K in earnings. If I am not mistaken that number currently stands at 100K. Of course, this really hurts the small business owner. As most of you are aware, self-employed individuals, like myself at times, pay the entirety of the SS tax (over 15%). Why would small businesse owners and middle class 2 income families who earn between 100-200K have to contribute more to social security to aid the poor. Are you dems on this site saying that 100K-200K 2 income families are rich:shrug:
this one first since for me it is the main problem.

I don't know, outside reallllly expensive places like New York and San Francisco, 100-200k a year seems like upper-middle class at worst. I wouldn't say uber-RICH of course,
but if you are making over double the average American, can you really consider yourself in the middle? Seems a bit disingenuous.

That being said, the middle class does usually seem to get the shaft, because they are too rich to get any social services, but too poor to be able to pay taxes without wincing.

 

[Cie]

I don't know, outside reallllly expensive places like New York and San Francisco, 100-200k a year seems like upper-middle class at worst. I wouldn't say uber-RICH of course,
but if you are making over double the average American, can you really consider yourself in the middle? Seems a bit disingenuous.

That being said, the middle class does usually seem to get the shaft, because they are too rich to get any social services, but too poor to be able to pay taxes without wincing.

Although I feel that you and I use the term disingenuous differently (at least I hope so), I appreciate you responding to my post.

Either way, why not pass ther buck to the actual rich?

 

[ImFeklhr]

Although I feel that you and I use the term disingenuous differently (at least I hope so), I appreciate you responding to my post.

Either way, why not pass ther buck to the actual rich?

maybe poor word choice on my point.. :nono:

BUT... nobody wants to be considered rich, when it's time to set the level of what makes someone 'rich' for tax purposes. Just because you don't have money, doesn't mean you don't have anything other means to benefit society. Conversely just because you DO have money, shouldn't preclude you from servicing the country in non-monetary ways.

I think we should ALL pay our share. Even poor people shouldn't get a free ride. If you get a government service, you should perform some community service in turn. To use a cliche phrase: "pay it forward"

I know the term "we" or "us" has fallen by the wayside, but the more we consider ourselves "in this together" the better off we are. The more we play the "he should have to support me" "he shouldn't have more than me" games, the more divisive life becomes.

<drunken, 'people should treat each other better,' rant over>

 

[escarzamd]

Friend sent me this......



Subject: FW: INTERESTING HISTORY TEST









A little history lesson. If you don't know the answer make your best guess.

Answer all the questions before looking at the answers.

Who said it?

1) "We're going to take things away from you on behalf of the common good."

A. Karl Marx
B. Adolph Hitler
C. Joseph Stalin
D. None of the above

2) "It's time for a new beginning, for an end to government of the
few, by the few, and for the few...... And to replace it with shared
responsibility for shared prosperity."

A. Lenin
B. Mussolini
C. Idi Amin
D. None of the Above

3) "(We) ...can't just let business as usual go on, and that means
something has to be tak en away from some people."

A. Nikita Khrushev
B. Josef Goebbels
C. Boris Yeltsin
D. None of the above

4) "We have to build a political consensus and that requires people to
give up a little bit of their own .. in order to create this common ground."


A. Mao Tse Dung
B. Hugo Chavez
C. Kim Jong Il
D. None of the above

5) "I certainly think the free-market has failed."

A. Karl Marx
B. Lenin
C. Molotov
D. None of the above

6) "I think it's time to send a clear message to what has become the most
profitable sector in (the) entire economy that they are being watched."

A. Pinochet
B. Milosevic
C. Saddam Hussein
D. None of the above


Scroll down for answers





Answers

(1) D. None of the above. Statement was made by Hillary Clinton 6/29/2004
(2) D. None of the above. Statement was made by Hillary Clinton 5/29/2007
(3) D. None of the above. Statement was made by Hillary Clinton 6/4/2007
(4) D. None of the above. Statement was made by Hillary Clinton 6/4/2007
(5) D. None of the above. Statement was made by Hillary Clinton 6/4/2007
(6) D. None of the above. Statement was made by Hillary Clinton 9/2/2005


:scared :com: :scared :com: :scared

 

[escarzamd]

>> *At first I thought this was funny...then I realized the awful truth of
>>it.* *Be sure to read all the way to the end! *
>>
>>*Tax his land,*
>>*Tax his bed,*
>>*Tax the table*
>>*At which he's fed.*
>>
>>*Tax his tractor,*
>>*Tax his mule,*
>>*Teach him taxes*
>>*Are the rule.*
>>
>>*Tax his cow,*
>>*Tax his goat,*
>>*Tax his pants,*
>>*Tax his coat.*
>>
>>*Tax his ties,*
>>*Tax his shirt, **
>>Tax his work,
>>Tax his dirt.
>>
>>Tax his tobacco,
>>Tax his drink,
>>Tax him if he
>>Tries to think.
>>
>>Tax his cigars,
>>Tax his beers,
>>If he cries, then*
>>
>>*Tax his tears. **
>>
>>Tax his car,
>>Tax his gas,
>>Find other ways
>>To tax his ass
>>
>>Tax all he has
>>Then let him know
>>That you won't be done
>>Till he has no dough.
>>
>>When he screams and hollers,
>>Then tax him some more,
>>Tax him till
>>He's good and sore.
>>
>>Then tax his coffin ,
>>Tax his grave,
>>Tax the sod in
>>Which he's laid.
>>
>>Put these words
>>upon his tomb,
>>" Taxes drove me to my doom..."
>>
>>When he's gone,
>>Do not relax,
>>Its time to apply
>>The inheritance tax.
>>
>>Accounts Receivable Tax
>>Building Permit Tax
>>CDL license Tax
>>Cigarette Tax
>>Corporate Income Tax
>>Dog License Tax
>>Excise Taxes
>>Federal Income Tax
>>Federal Unemployment Tax (FUTA)
>>Fishing License Tax
>>Food License Tax
>>Fuel Permit Tax
>>Gasoline Tax (42 cents per gallon)
>>Gross Receipts Tax
>>Hunting License Tax
>>Inheritance Tax
>>Inventory Tax
>>IRS Interest Charges IRS Penalties (tax on top of tax)
>>Liquor Tax
>>Luxury Taxes
>>Marriage License Tax
>>Medicare Tax
>>Personal Property Tax
>>Property Tax
>>Real Estate Tax
>>Service Charge Tax
>>Social Security Tax
>>Road Usage Tax
>>Sales Tax
>>Recreational Vehicle Tax
>>School Tax
>>State Income Tax
>>State Unemployment Tax (SUTA)
>>Telephone Federal Excise Tax
>>Telephone Federal Universal Service Fee Tax
>>Telephone Federal, State and Local Surcharge Taxes
>>Telephone Minimum Usage Surcharge Tax
>>Telephone Recurring and Non-recurring Charges Tax
>>Telephone State and Local Tax
>>Telephone Usage Charge Tax
>>Utility Taxes
>>Vehicle License Registration Tax
>>Vehicle Sales Tax
>>Watercraft Registration Tax
>>Well Permit Tax
>>Workers Compensation Tax
>>
>>STILL THINK THIS IS FUNNY?*
>>
>>**Not one of these taxes existed 100 years ago,**
>>
>>**and our nation was the most prosperous in the world. **
>>
>>**We had absolutely no national debt, had the largest middle class in the
>>world, and Mom stayed home to raise the kids. **
>>
>>*What the hell happened? Can you spell "politicians!" *
>>
>>**And I still have to "press 1"**
>>
>>*for English.** **:shrug:

 

[Toledo Prophet]

Friend sent me this......



Subject: FW: INTERESTING HISTORY TEST









A little history lesson. If you don't know the answer make your best guess.

Answer all the questions before looking at the answers.

Who said it?

1) "We're going to take things away from you on behalf of the common good."

A. Karl Marx
B. Adolph Hitler
C. Joseph Stalin
D. None of the above

2) "It's time for a new beginning, for an end to government of the
few, by the few, and for the few...... And to replace it with shared
responsibility for shared prosperity."

A. Lenin
B. Mussolini
C. Idi Amin
D. None of the Above

3) "(We) ...can't just let business as usual go on, and that means
something has to be tak en away from some people."

A. Nikita Khrushev
B. Josef Goebbels
C. Boris Yeltsin
D. None of the above

4) "We have to build a political consensus and that requires people to
give up a little bit of their own .. in order to create this common ground."


A. Mao Tse Dung
B. Hugo Chavez
C. Kim Jong Il
D. None of the above

5) "I certainly think the free-market has failed."

A. Karl Marx
B. Lenin
C. Molotov
D. None of the above

6) "I think it's time to send a clear message to what has become the most
profitable sector in (the) entire economy that they are being watched."

A. Pinochet
B. Milosevic
C. Saddam Hussein
D. None of the above


Scroll down for answers





Answers

(1) D. None of the above. Statement was made by Hillary Clinton 6/29/2004
(2) D. None of the above. Statement was made by Hillary Clinton 5/29/2007
(3) D. None of the above. Statement was made by Hillary Clinton 6/4/2007
(4) D. None of the above. Statement was made by Hillary Clinton 6/4/2007
(5) D. None of the above. Statement was made by Hillary Clinton 6/4/2007
(6) D. None of the above. Statement was made by Hillary Clinton 9/2/2005


:scared :com: :scared :com: :scared

Cant believe I'm responding to anything is this forum as I find from lurking through it that most people are so rigid and locked into their opinions, that it can get a little ridiculous.

Anyway, I would be careful to take anything from those mass emails which get sent around as truth and gospel.

Its likely those quotes are chery picked....but also consider the different spin on it if the choices were different historical leaders rather than the notorious ones listed in the quiz.....if the choices were Teddy Roosevelt, MLK, Lincoln, FDR, or even Reagan (who would have clearly said something like #3 in regards to entitlement programs), maybe Ole Hill would not look as scary.

Then again, thats the point of those mass emails to blur the issue and make their target seem like the scariest option out there.

As far as that tax email you also posted, I've been sent that one too.....they might not have shared the same names, but there were lots and lots of taxes back then, many of which actually did tax the same things as today.....not sure just how prosperous we were back then anyway, the turn of the century was rife with labor strife, middle-to lower income unrest and TR--really one of my favorite presidents of all time--struck a cord with his progressive stances.

Not looking to start any arguments here....just passing through.....i love reading Cie's posts in the capping forums, was interested in what he had to say here.

Cie: Good luck studying the candidates, hope you find somebody you like! :weed:

 

[escarzamd]

Find this stuff entertaining because I'm frustrated. Tired of the pandering and jostling for position, and protecting the lead and the whole national political forum.

Can't wait for some substantive discussion from the prospects regarding the issues at hand ....

I stand appropriately chastised for the mass-mailing forward:shrug:

 

[redsfann]

Find this stuff entertaining because I'm frustrated. Tired of the pandering and jostling for position, and protecting the lead and the whole national political forum.

Can't wait for some substantive discussion from the prospects regarding the issues at hand ....

I stand appropriately chastised for the mass-mailing forward:shrug:

you're in the Quad Cities, right? If not, please disregard, but if you are, you can't help but be wore out on the election already, and its A YEAR AWAY!

And talk about pandering...EVERYONE of the candidates that stops in the area for a photo-op has a new 'plan' laid out for how to improve this or that-and the craziest thing is they have EXACT dollar amounts as to what it will do for me, the poor, exploited middle-class taxpayer. They all start out...'When I'm President, I will put forth a bill that will put 2000 dollars in every ones pocket..." Please.

 

[Toledo Prophet]

Find this stuff entertaining because I'm frustrated. Tired of the pandering and jostling for position, and protecting the lead and the whole national political forum.

Can't wait for some substantive discussion from the prospects regarding the issues at hand ....

I stand appropriately chastised for the mass-mailing forward:shrug:

Hey Man, its all good; was harldy trying to chastise you, sorry if it came off that way. That's why i avoid commenting on this particular forum because it is so hard to judge people's actual tone.....i share your frustration, not just at the politcos, but the media.....maybe if they would spotlight some of the major issues instead of worrying about the election and who is, as you said, protecting the lead, maybe we would get that substantive discussion on the issues that both you and I are yearning for.

But, hey why cover issues when you have Brittany Spears and her custody battle to cover :shrug:

 

[THE KOD]

But, hey why cover issues when you have Brittany Spears and her custody battle to cover :shrug:

.............................................................

I was just wondering if Brittany had cut her
hair again.

 

[Toledo Prophet]

.............................................................

I was just wondering if Brittany had cut her
hair again.

I dont know.....but i am sure Katie Couric is all over this story!

 

[THE KOD]

Senator Clinton offered the clearest statement of her own ? and her husband's ? philosophy that I've ever heard. It came during a brisk question-and-answer session with local residents.


A retired dairy farmer complained about the deregulation of his industry and asked what she'd do about it.

"During this campaign, you're going to hear me talk a lot about the importance of balance," she began, after acknowledging that the Bush Administration had gone too far toward deregulation in most areas. "You know, our politics can get a little imbalanced sometimes. We move off to the left or off to the right, but eventually we find our way back to the center because Americans are problem solvers. We are not ideologues. Most people are just looking for sensible, commonsense solutions."

......................................................

And to this response the retired farmer said ...
wtf did she just say ? What a load of both sides of the mouth bullshit. There is not a answer in there.

If there is a answer in there. Someone of you Hillary advocates please explain it.

 

[Roger Baltrey]

Cie,

It's pretty hard to make a case for old Hill. But her opponent is going to be Crazy Rudi. Is that who you want carrying a nuclear suitcase around. And you mentioned "any of the dems". Could there be a worse presidency than the last 8 years with the the buffoon we currently have. Since we're on a gambling site, isn't it nice to know that this administration made it a priority to make sure Joe Six Pack couldn't blow his dough on off shore web sites while we are fightin the war on terrorism. And you mentioned taxing the rich. How do I get back the $500 billion we spent removing WMD from Iraq. Let me make a suggestion, who about a 3rd party candidate.

 

[THE KOD]

Let me make a suggestion, who about a 3rd party candidate.

.........................................................

Thats the problem with this country. A third party candidate stands no chance up against the
entrenched power money grubbers who are running at the top.


How does Rudi work as a federal prosecutor and you call him a idiot.

I think thats a reach.

 

[Roger Baltrey]

Scott,

I didn't call him an idiot. And I will probably end up voting for him. Doesn't he seem a little crazy to you. Like he could go off at any time. That is not a real good trait when you control the the most potent weapons in the history of the world. I think a 3rd party candidate could do some damage this time.

 

[escarzamd]

Born in Moline.....now live in Rockford, but home enough to catch the Times blurbs there redsfan. I'm going just as nuts as you HAVE to be.

Who in hell can we vote for??

Ole Hill? Insider. Hypocrite. Hardly inspirational.

Edwards? Flip-Flopping, pandering trial lawayer.

Obama? Civil-rights idealogue...at least not an obvious insider and optimistic, questionable qualification.

Guiliani? NOT qualified, possibly dangerous.

Thompson? Please, not another B-list actor who can't present a single meaningful answer to a simple question.

McCain? Hopeful, but too old, too much cow-towing to the evangelicals, and hung himself on Iraq already.

Huckabee? Complete sky-pilot.

Romney? Head further into clouds than Huckabee, plus a flip-flopper.

Gore? Ripe for the taking, but could dangerously divide Democratic party, which already seems to suffer fron lack of ability to grab ass with either, much less both hands

Bloomberg? Double-edge sword, but something attractive about someone so filthy rich that he can govern without being led around by the nose by special-interest lobby, as if that mattered with the 2nd grade class that is our legislative branch.

Ron Paul looks better everyday. Not to say I agree with his platform line by line; And, having nothing to lose makes it easy to keep message straight, but isn't everyone's wet dream a grass-roots revolution leading to an overhaul of the way we do business?

The whole process is leading to waves of nausea in conflict with a strong urge to drink lots. Thank goodness for ballgames, or I would have to take every anti-depressant on the market.

PS KOD......which end did Brittany shave today???

 

[THE KOD]

Ron Paul looks better everyday. Not to say I agree with his platform line by line; And, having nothing to lose makes it easy to keep message straight, but isn't everyone's wet dream a grass-roots revolution leading to an overhaul of the way we do business?

The whole process is leading to waves of nausea in conflict with a strong urge to drink lots. Thank goodness for ballgames, or I would have to take every anti-depressant on the market.

PS KOD......which end did Brittany shave today???

...........................................................

haha you got a pretty good list there.

I would honestly consider voting for Ron Paul.

If Hillary wins I will go into a deep depression.
It could be the end of the world as we know it.

 

[THE KOD]

Scott,

I didn't call him an idiot. And I will probably end up voting for him. Doesn't he seem a little crazy to you. Like he could go off at any time. That is not a real good trait when you control the the most potent weapons in the history of the world. I think a 3rd party candidate could do some damage this time.

..............................................................

I will have to consider voting for him if it means it keeps Hillary out of office.

I do not think Rudi seems crazy. We have had Bush and Cheney for 8 yrs. Thats crazy.

I voted for Ross Perot that year he ran. I was tired of the crap way back when and wanted change at all costs. Perot didnt have a chance.

I hate to waste my vote

 

[smurphy]

If Hillary wins I will go into a deep depression.
It could be the end of the world as we know it.

Oh for God's sake.