Chicago murders and shootings

[Penguinfan]

you're serious, no mass shootings in other countries??

you may find this interesting then, but again this is more than a "gun control" issue ultimately...

https://crimeresearch.org/2015/06/c...m-mass-public-shootings-in-the-us-and-europe/

I will readily admit I do not know what the gun control laws are in places like Albania or Macedonia, but I can take a quick Google search of their population and see that because approximately four people died as a result of a mass shootings in Albania it puts them ahead of us on the list.

Macedonia? Looks like six.

I don't think that list is a fair representation of the issue at hand and, let's face it, you can make up any chart to "prove" your point, but in a case like this the issue/solve is pretty apparent.

 

[Livin'tillthEnd]

I will readily admit I do not know what the gun control laws are in places like Albania or Macedonia, but I can take a quick Google search of their population and see that because approximately four people died as a result of a mass shootings in Albania it puts them ahead of us on the list.

Macedonia? Looks like six.

I don't think that list is a fair representation of the issue at hand and, let's face it, you can make up any chart to "prove" your point, but in a case like this the issue/solve is pretty apparent.

earlier in the thread Norway and Finland were mentioned as better comparables but you're right Macedonia probably not..Australia has a good number of people killed by arson attacks since 2009. They should probably look at banning fire or some s. Point being, crazy people who want to kill, WILL find a way..really that simple...As i said prior im in the minority of this topic so I dont expect to change peoples minds..good luck today if you bet NFL

 

[Penguinfan]

earlier in the thread Norway and Finland were mentioned as better comparables but you're right Macedonia probably not..Australia has a good number of people killed by arson attacks since 2009. They should probably look at banning fire or some s. Point being, crazy people who want to kill, WILL find a way..really that simple...As i said prior im in the minority of this topic so I dont expect to change peoples minds..good luck today if you bet NFL

You are correct, crazy people will find a way to kill if that is what they want to do. That is not an excuse for us to enable them, though.

 

[yyz]

I understand we will most likely always have guns. But as long as we are addressing mental illness, who in their right mind can't see that if guns were never invented, there would be a lot more people alive today?

Why is that so hard to admit for some of you?

 

[Livin'tillthEnd]

I understand we will most likely always have guns. But as long as we are addressing mental illness, who in their right mind can't see that if guns were never invented, there would be a lot more people alive today?

Why is that so hard to admit for some of you?

then this is a mute issue, no? but ultimately guns dont fkn shoot themselves--why is this so hard for some of you to understand?

but if guns were never invented, then people I guess would kill people with spears or rocks, etc---holy f what if people werent invented then no one would kill anyone :facepalm:

 

[Penguinfan]

then this is a mute issue, no? but ultimately guns dont fkn shoot themselves--why is this so hard for some of you to understand?

but if guns were never invented, then people I guess would kill people with spears or rocks, etc---holy f what if people werent invented then no one would kill anyone :facepalm:

You are taking the endgame (which is the fact guns will never be outlawed in this country) and making it the argument. Certainly you are correct, if there were no guns people would figure out other ways to kill if they so desire, but to use your own analogy, it would be awful difficult to mass spear people from a hotel room in Vegas.

Would the assailant have chosen a bomb instead, drove a truck into the crowd? I don't know, and the reality is neither do you. What we do know is he chose to mow down people with a modified semi automatic weapon and was able to kill dozens, from distance, easily. The last word that is what should bring pause for concern. It's made too easy with the ease of which those weapons can be obtained.

That is where the should be some common ground, but there isn't. The stance of the pro gun people is that if they give up a weapon, ANY weapon then the gov't will come for all of them. To which I would ask for an example of that happening.

Much like the question about how it doesn't happen as easily in other countries, that question does not get answered.

 

[Livin'tillthEnd]

You are taking the endgame (which is the fact guns will never be outlawed in this country) and making it the argument. Certainly you are correct, if there were no guns people would figure out other ways to kill if they so desire, but to use your own analogy, it would be awful difficult to mass spear people from a hotel room in Vegas.

Would the assailant have chosen a bomb instead, drove a truck into the crowd? I don't know, and the reality is neither do you. What we do know is he chose to mow down people with a modified semi automatic weapon and was able to kill dozens, from distance, easily. The last word that is what should bring pause for concern. It's made too easy with the ease of which those weapons can be obtained.

That is where the should be some common ground, but there isn't. The stance of the pro gun people is that if they give up a weapon, ANY weapon then the gov't will come for all of them. To which I would ask for an example of that happening.

Much like the question about how it doesn't happen as easily in other countries, that question does not get answered.

it does per capita as evidenced by the article I sent to you, or does that not count??..the issue is its much more a political issue here and politicized through media...I never said I don't believe there should be background checks and we should be able to obtain a 240b as I used in my stint with the military, but it is a fact its harder to get a gun in IL than TX, as this started with the article about Chicago. Stricter gun laws are BS when it comes to crazy mfers wanting to kill people.
BTW please tell me you don't believe a old, out of shape "gambler" carried off Vegas by himself...for another time i guess--got other shit to do.

 

[yyz]

then this is a mute issue, no? but ultimately guns dont fkn shoot themselves--why is this so hard for some of you to understand?

but if guns were never invented, then people I guess would kill people with spears or rocks, etc---holy f what if people werent invented then no one would kill anyone :facepalm:

Of course people would still kill each other. Funny thing is, the ratio of rocks to guns is a million to one. I would think there would be far more murders commited with rocks. I wonder why that's not the case?

I take that back. I don't wonder at all.

 

[Snafu]

earlier in the thread Norway and Finland were mentioned as better comparables but you're right Macedonia probably not..Australia has a good number of people killed by arson attacks since 2009. They should probably look at banning fire or some s. Point being, crazy people who want to kill, WILL find a way..really that simple...As i said prior im in the minority of this topic so I dont expect to change peoples minds..good luck today if you bet NFL

it's very difficult to make fair and comparable international stats about these subjects. Norway leads easily because of one incident that caused 67 + 110 in casualties, France and Belgium have been terrorist attack targets. Four terrorist attacks in France left 150 dead + 382 injured.

We had two school shootings here in Finland , 2007 and -08, combined 20 casualties and one bombing 2002 that left 7 dead and 166 injured. if these would have been on this chart it would have looked quite different.

can't say any of these could have been stopped by gun laws.
tighter immigration laws would have worked way better.


but as said above, it's about peoples attitude towards other people, simple as that