Gumby's war

[DOGS THAT BARK]

Take your pick--from European allies -conservatives or liberal--if times short--don't miss Krauthammers-
-Todays most read Real Clear Politics
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/?state=noad


Most Read
Last 24 Hours
President Seems Out of His Depth and Incompetent
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The Professor's War
- Charles Krauthammer, Orange County Register
I Am Not The Only One Confused
- Eugene Robinson, Washington Post
The Weakest Commander-in-Chief Ever?
- Nile Gardiner, Daily Telegraph

 

[DOGS THAT BARK]

Interesting we have only 2 threads on this war with little participation.

Can imagine the hoopla had this been in GW's era.

Of course this is a ""kinetic military action" not a war as you will hear in speech tonight.

IMO I am not against action but against the waffeling for 31 days and then letting French grab O by the ears and lead him. I assume everyone knows Frances vested interest?

Also I am not much on the delusions and fabrications made so far.

I can tell you with certainty from experience as vet vs acorn organizer that this action will be weeks/months vs days--we already have troops on ground--and toss up which will cost more--the military action or rebuilding.

Whether action was good move will be determined by results. Will we actually remove him and bigger question--who are these rebels that will replace him.

As we've seen in Egypt--appears we will have a western ally in all probabilty replaced with the Muslim Brotherhood.

I also ask myself--why Libya and not a peep on Iran last year or Syria now?

 

[Chadman]

I hardly think you can compare the situation and implementation of being a partial participant in a no-fly zone and rebel assistance in Libya to the situations in Syria and Iran. How could the situations of the three be measured equally? Other than just to raise even more political concern about Obama in a side-swipe comment?

 

[DOGS THAT BARK]

I hardly think you can compare the situation and implementation of being a partial participant in a no-fly zone and rebel assistance in Libya to the situations in Syria and Iran. How could the situations of the three be measured equally? Other than just to raise even more political concern about Obama in a side-swipe comment?

Quite true--Libya posed no threat to us or any allies--and don't have to go into threat Iran and Syria pose --do I? Your correct--no comparison

Once again I am not against this action--IF rebels become allies (which I would assume our intelligence has already determined-hopefully)--I'm against the double talk-waffling-flopping at every change that occurs.
It is no longer a shadow of a doubt of O being a leader or follower/fence sitter--and grifter to nth degree.

--everyone sees it--our enimies and allies alike

The Weakest Commander-in-Chief Ever?
- Nile Gardiner, Daily Telegraph

 

[ssd]

If this is a 'humanitarian effort", i do want to know why we have bypassed Darfur and Rwanda and Syria and Iran and China and all the other areas that play host to genocide.

Is it because war is profitable when oil is involved?

Do we really know who the rebels are? And what their intentions are? Egypt got rid of Mubarak and I do not think many changes have occurred there - replaced one dictator with a military regime dictator?

 

[BobbyBlueChip]

I hardly think you can compare the situation and implementation of being a partial participant in a no-fly zone and rebel assistance in Libya to the situations in Syria and Iran?

Dogs can. Just watch

 

[Trampled Underfoot]

I'm not reading through doggies shit today but did he actually come out and say he was against the killing of minorities? I can't believe he would be against the death of the non-whites. :shrug:

 

[Chadman]

I briefly reviewed the four attack columns of Obama's handling of Libya, just for the heck of it. What that did was reinforce my thinking that conservatives are going to rip him any way he can about anything they can. If you can't see that in the combination of four different articles there, you're not thinking objectively.

He's ripped for being there at all. He's ripped for taking too much time to decide. He's ripped for acting in this case, and not in countless other cases. He's criticized for not taking the lead on the conflict, then Robinson ridicules those saying we're not in the lead on the conflict as "not being real" about the situation there. Essentially criticizing the others you linked us to in the process.

The gang-criticism from conservatives is at such a frenzy that I suppose even Karl Rove has not had enough time to make sense of it and send out the company-wide memo of talking points yet. To hear many of them talk, I suggest they aren't even sure about WHAT to complain about, they just feel that they HAVE to complain - or hint that there might be problems in the future because of us being there.

I think the funniest criticisms come from those suggesting this is oil protectionism, many of these folks were rabidly against that thinking with the Iraq situation. As if there can possibly be any real difference at this point? I guess it just matters who is in office at the time you are being asked the questions, right?

 

[The Sponge]

u ask any reasonable thinking American if they care if we lead in another god awful war and i bet all 100 percent would say to let someone else lead for a change. Now the Fox News crowd will want us to lead because once again they have been misinformed about everything from their puppeteer's. Misinformed by a bunch of guys who would run and hide if they were called to fight.

 

[Trampled Underfoot]

u ask any reasonable thinking American if they care if we lead in another god awful war and i bet all 100 percent would say to let someone else lead for a change. Now the Fox News crowd will want us to lead because once again they have been misinformed about everything from their puppeteer's. Misinformed by a bunch of guys who would run and hide if they were called to fight.

That is what is so funny about this whole thing. I'm totally against this action but I do get pleasure from the same moron neo-cons who are all of a sudden appalled by the war machine. Just like they are all of a sudden concerned about the spending crisis. Where the fuck have these people been for the 8 years before this? You just have to shake your head at these tools.

 

[DOGS THAT BARK]

I briefly reviewed the four attack columns of Obama's handling of Libya, just for the heck of it. What that did was reinforce my thinking that conservatives are going to rip him any way he can about anything they can. If you can't see that in the combination of four different articles there, you're not thinking objectively.

He's ripped for being there at all. He's ripped for taking too much time to decide. He's ripped for acting in this case, and not in countless other cases. He's criticized for not taking the lead on the conflict, then Robinson ridicules those saying we're not in the lead on the conflict as "not being real" about the situation there. Essentially criticizing the others you linked us to in the process.

The gang-criticism from conservatives is at such a frenzy that I suppose even Karl Rove has not had enough time to make sense of it and send out the company-wide memo of talking points yet. To hear many of them talk, I suggest they aren't even sure about WHAT to complain about, they just feel that they HAVE to complain - or hint that there might be problems in the future because of us being there.

I think the funniest criticisms come from those suggesting this is oil protectionism, many of these folks were rabidly against that thinking with the Iraq situation. As if there can possibly be any real difference at this point? I guess it just matters who is in office at the time you are being asked the questions, right?

Best point made Chad--

--however when you have a pres flop on every issue involved --that presents a problem.

One day its--
"The President does not have power under the Constitution to unilaterally authorize a military attack in a situation that does not involve stopping an actual or imminent threat to the nation."

--and the next--

check this interview out--
http://www.boston.com/news/politics/2008/specials/CandidateQA/ObamaQA/


Honestly Chad--and think about this carefully.
Is there anything O has said in past or will say in future that you have confidence to take him at his word?
He has no principles or a least none that can't be compromised--and how many times will his flock allow him to vote present till they get a clue what all hat/no cattle represents?

 

[Duff Miver]

--however when you have a pres flop on every issue involved --

And there's the problem. doggie thinks Obama has flopped on every issue because that's what Linbaugh and Fox Nooze tell him.

doggie doesn't know that during his first two years in office, Obama compiled a substantial record of policy accomplishment?the economic stimulus, bringing the financial system back from the brink of collapse, rescuing two automakers, universal health care, sweeping reform of financial regulation, and major changes in student loan programs, among many others.


doggie doesn't know because he won't pull his nose from Hanniy's anus long enough to come up for air.

But we already know that doggie has been a champion brown noser since grammar school -

http://www.madjacksports.com/forum/showthread.php?p=2884637#post2884637

 

[The Sponge]

And there's the problem. doggie thinks Obama has flopped on every issue because that's what Linbaugh and Fox Nooze tell him.

doggie doesn't know that during his first two years in office, Obama compiled a substantial record of policy accomplishment?the economic stimulus, bringing the financial system back from the brink of collapse, rescuing two automakers, universal health care, sweeping reform of financial regulation, and major changes in student loan programs, among many others.


doggie doesn't know because he won't pull his nose from Hanniy's anus long enough to come up for air.

But we already know that doggie has been a champion brown noser since grammar school -

http://www.madjacksports.com/forum/showthread.php?p=2884637#post2884637

in Doggies defense Bush rarely flip flopped. He stuck with what was wrong and stayed the course even when people were trying to bang his head against the wall.

 

[Trench]

in Doggies defense Bush rarely flip flopped. He stuck with what was wrong and stayed the course even when people were trying to bang his head against the wall.

In Dubya's defense... Cheney, Rove, Rumsfeld & Wolfawitz charted a disastrous course for America and Dubya just wanted to show his Daddy that he could make decisions just like a real grown-up. :0003

 

[Chadman]

Best point made Chad--

--however when you have a pres flop on every issue involved --that presents a problem.

One day its--
"The President does not have power under the Constitution to unilaterally authorize a military attack in a situation that does not involve stopping an actual or imminent threat to the nation."

--and the next--

check this interview out--
http://www.boston.com/news/politics/2008/specials/CandidateQA/ObamaQA/


Honestly Chad--and think about this carefully.
Is there anything O has said in past or will say in future that you have confidence to take him at his word?
He has no principles or a least none that can't be compromised--and how many times will his flock allow him to vote present till they get a clue what all hat/no cattle represents?

Wayne, I cannot agree with you on a blanket whitewash of Obama's record. I think on some issues he's stood fast and gotten things done - not that the other side (and you) would agree with those things. He's been very strong on several issues, and deserves respect for those - although you and those who micro-examine his motives don't agree.

I can't think of many Presidents who came into office and had to deal with what Obama has had to deal with. Some, yes. But what irritates me is seeing such rampant criticism about someone who considers more than one option in many cases - as the leader of the free world - and seeing that criticism as being self-appointedly accurate is just sad.

I am having a very difficult time with where the country is headed, despite seeing some promising economic signs - some thanks to the efforts undertaken by the Obama administration. At least I'm honest about it. Which is more than I can say about many of the conservatives here - and you - who I don't think would ever consider voting for a democrat. If you would, please tell me one that you have voted for in your life, and why?

I think the economics of our country have changed completely in the past several years. It STARTED with Bush, and I don't see real efforts on the democratic side to aggressively face those situations. I may have to hold my nose in the next election and vote with what I think is appropriate for the economic (and defense-related) good of this country, which certainly could be conservative based.

But one thing that will always now make me hesitant to vote conservative is thanks to the Supreme Court - who has effectively made my voice nearly nonexistent in the big picture by allowing the major corporations to control the message and dominate our election process.

 

[The Sponge]

Which is more than I can say about many of the conservatives here - and you - who I don't think would ever consider voting for a democrat. If you would, please tell me one that you have voted for in your life, and why?

Shut him up Doggie and tell him. Lieberman would be ur man. Well he used to be a Democrat until he dropped the first five letters from the word Democrat.

 

[Trampled Underfoot]

I wanted to add something about the term flip-flopper. That is not a bad thing at all. I swear it is such a powerful tool for morons to pounce on. However, a real leader is one who takes new information and then makes a decision with all the available information at that time. Just because you had one viewpoint at one time does not mean you should go to your grave with the same viewpoint. The world changes and these are complex issues. I guess for simpletons they make up their mind and that is it for them. Don't bore me with new information and facts. That is how you get fat, lazy and stupid. Sound familiar?

This is not supporting or bashing Obama. It's just a fact. Intelligent people sometimes change their minds. :facepalm:

 

[Trench]

I wanted to add something about the term flip-flopper. That is not a bad thing at all. I swear it is such a powerful tool for morons to pounce on. However, a real leader is one who takes new information and then makes a decision with all the available information at that time. Just because you had one viewpoint at one time does not mean you should go to your grave with the same viewpoint. The world changes and these are complex issues. I guess for simpletons they make up their mind and that is it for them. Don't bore me with new information and facts. That is how you get fat, lazy and stupid. Sound familiar?

This is not supporting or bashing Obama. It's just a fact. Intelligent people sometimes change their minds. :facepalm:

Well said, Tramp.

I mean, when you hear the term "flip-flopper", you almost expect the person using it to follow it up with... "liar, liar, pants on fire".

 

[The Sponge]

I wanted to add something about the term flip-flopper. That is not a bad thing at all. I swear it is such a powerful tool for morons to pounce on. However, a real leader is one who takes new information and then makes a decision with all the available information at that time. Just because you had one viewpoint at one time does not mean you should go to your grave with the same viewpoint. The world changes and these are complex issues. I guess for simpletons they make up their mind and that is it for them. Don't bore me with new information and facts. That is how you get fat, lazy and stupid. Sound familiar?

This is not supporting or bashing Obama. It's just a fact. Intelligent people sometimes change their minds. :facepalm:

Tramp who does this sound like?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias

 

[kcwolf]

I missed the speech tonight. Did President Obama land on an aircraft carrier and announce "mission accomplished"?