MadJack/Last FewDays/Weeks

[djv]

Yes I cancelled out of SB party. Why because I know I pee-d off some big names here. They will be there and I will never ruin a good party for them or anyone. Because of some very strong feelings I have about what went on here last few weeks maybe more like months. I like honesty to the fullest. So here I go again trying to say it with out getting everyone worked up. But this is for everyone here and the well being of the site. Those who are selling picks where ever. Then place picks here also. Well seems a long time ago it should have been out in open these picks were not going to be top ones. We had folks here take some hits on some of these because they thought it was there best. I started fadeing some of these picks everyother day because you could see they had no consistency. I new from the past when getting the best from certian guys they held up better. I really, even if I never met any of these folks in person. I got to like them a lot. So when I said the other day it was like a kick in the nuts. I meant that. I should have said this 2 months back. That's my fault. So MJ why not send just you a email and not post this. WEll Because of what I believe in. Streight talk no BS makes this the right place to be. The action you have just taken is the right thing to do. Now we need to make sure everyone here understands. We are not always getting some ones top plays. It may look like it. But there not. So I say from now on anyone should be able to say to the poster. Are these your Best or just the Rest. That I believe is Fair. For anyone I may have offended. Sorry. That's not what this is about. For those who think what I just said is not fair. I understand. I said it and hope it helps all of us here.
GL Dave
One last word if I might. Please I do not want this turned into a nasty post. I just soon you read and say nothing. Im not looking to keep score on those who may say ya right on. Or those who may say your full of shit Dave. This is about just one thing. I believe if you read it again you will see that.

 

[fletcher]

i told you over a month ago when you made a post what are we getting from people who sell picks and you said i know what i get from fletcher and someone else and i wrote you and said all 5* were used in less i didnot say it wasnot and 4* i played so get off your high horse and i am glad you are staying home you back stabber. dont even try to pull that you did not get a response from me in you thread and even said well i guess i struck a nerve because my thread was gone,well it wasnot gone it was moved to the bottom of the site because someone put an email address in it. and then you come on and say that you make good money fading me,but yet you were always up in the front on college football asking big east info and wvu insite and also questions on different pitchers in baseball.
you are unreal.

 

[Senor Capper]

Minding my own business...

Minding my own business...

.....which I rarely do, so that being said, DJV I was looking forward to meeting you in Vegas and still am.
Hope there is some way you will reconsider.

 

[WADARUSH]

The thing that was bugging me all along was the hush hush aspect. It seemed when someone would ask a straight ?, Hoops are you selling your picks, Hoops you're only posting 1 pick these days what up?, JT are you selling your picks? Either these ? went unanswered Or the thread would disappear.

 

[Senor Capper]

Its over so....

Its over so....

get over it



Geeze....
I'm surrounded by children (wadarush)

 

[WADARUSH]

bl-- me

 

[djv]

Fletch Read close what I said. Meant more for others that did not know what was going on. And yes I did fade some of your plays latey as well as another. As I said about everyother day. Hey they were winning for me what can I say. The part about BB Im not sure what that is about. Can't remember asking you anything about it. Had no reason to. If you say so, Ok. Fletch I was trying to help others. Thought thats what we were about here all along. I will stay with the site. I will not pull one of those Im done here im taking my picks someplace else BS jobs. Seen that from a couple folks here to. I just wish once if they don' like it here that much. When they say that there gone. They would stay gone. And stop the BS. There no one here better or above all the rest. It works because everyone pulled for each other. And yes Fletch if you had info that helped I said thank you many times. And yes when you answered your picks were on the market but you were still posting very good ones here. I believe they would have to be at least one level down. I mean it would not make sence to sell your best and then give them back free here. So YES I new what you were doing. I say great for you. But not here this is a free site. Sorry MJ I know you want this done with.

 

[ferdville]

djv - beg to differ on a few points, but can understand your feelings nevertheless. Fletcher always made it clear whether his picks were 3*, 4*, 5*, tip or whatever. I didn't follow either of the other cappers involved so I cannot speak from experience in their case. It was always clear to me that when fletcher offered a 3* or a 4*, it wasn't his strongest pick. So exactly who was fooled into thinking they were getting the best picks? Like you, I agree that the entire fiasco could have been avoided with clearn and open knowledge of what was going on.

 

[Natural Selection]

Djv, appreciate your stance. You are looking out for "little guy". So many times things can get mis-interpreted.

I missed all the hubbub of the past few days but have a general idea of what's going on. Gambling is like a narcotic and if you rely on somebody for a fix, then get cut off, bad blood soon boils. Most junkies would rather get their fix for nothing. But as is often the case in life, few things are free. If you can't shake it, then pay the piper for your fix.

Madjack has a wonderful site here. His integrity has shown through the message he posted. This is an awesome resource to "learn" from. Not everyone has the time to put in that is required to stay ahead of "the man". But through the generous sharing of able cappers such as Nick, Nolan, et al... this site still remains a great one to check out.

 

[nighthorse]

I'm fairly new here, and I might be missing something, but............

I'm not sure I understand all the fuss. As long someone posts their overall record for picks made on this site, then the other forum members can judge for themselves if the poster is worth reading and/or following. If cappers don't list their overall record, you should be more cautious with them to start with, and keep track yourself for a period of time before deciding you'
re comfortable with them. If Fletcher is posting his "lesser" plays, it should soon be evident, and he will lose credibility.

How do you attract new customers if your "free plays" suck? If Fletcher's lesser plays truly are lousy, it will eventually cost him business. It's like having Roseanne in the lobby of your whorehouse and promising the Swedish Bikini hangs out on the third floor...."but you can't see, you'll have to trust us....where's your money?"

The biggest part of handicapping around here is not capping the games, but capping the cappers. It's easier to do that when everybody is totally open about what their doing and their intentions. But we've got to realize that that's not always going to be the case. (In fact, it will rarely be the case).

I'm a capitalist. If people have something of value to sell, they should be allowed to sell it to willing buyers....a voluntary contract to the benefit of both. There's nothing wrong with that. If Madjack's becomes financially threatened, I say it's better to have an area where people can buy picks than to have no MJ's at all. We're all bright enough to keep the two areas separate. All the insistance on FREE, FREE, FREE!!! Makes me think I've joined some kind of communal peace farm....but if digging the bell bottoms out of the attic and dusting off the bong is required to stick around, I'll do it.

Just some thoughts.......I love this place.

 

[SKEETER1]

Short and sweet here....

Short and sweet here....

Madjack I am sorry but let me just say this...This is Fletchers job ( handicapping)...he has no other job....I have seen some of you post UR job..doctor, therapist, plumber. teacher, etc... so I ask you...would U do UR job for free? I ask the Dr would U serender ur sevices to see patients for free..Of Course Not....and would the Plumber come to UR house to fix a leak for free...Of Course Not...Would I teach UR kids for free...NOWAY IN HELL....So if this is Fletchers job then why should he do it for FREE...if U dont want to sign up for the $$ that was asked then dont pay it,,,,but dont ask him for his picks for free cause UR greedy and U wont fix others peoples problems in ur profession for free...CAN U NOT SEE THE CORRELATION...Fletcher I wouldnt pay U for ur pix but I might trade U a Rookie card of Ozzie Smith for a 1969 card of Tommy Agee...LMAO

 

[Juice]

Skeeter, I'm sorry but your correlation is flawed.

Let's take a doctor as an example. Suppose you make good money being a doctor, and in your spare time you do voulenteer work at the local clinic. You do it because you enjoy doing it and you enjoy helping others, that's all. You don't do it because you have to and you don't do it to make money (you make plenty of money with your private practice).

As time goes by you realize that people really like your work. They come to depend on you and like going to that clinic becauseof you. You have a way of dealing with people and you always know what to prescribe. So you get an idea. "These people really like me", you say to yourself "Maybe I can make money off of them. They've come to rely on me and I'm sure they wouldn't mind paying for me to look at them. I know I've always done it for free in the past, and I know that this is a free clinic, but what the hey...I might as well try and make some money. Oh, I'll still see other non paying people, but I will not give them as good advice as I will to my paying customers. And if the clinic doesn't like it, I'll take my instruments and go to another clinic.
And I know I've always said that doctors that try to charge a fee at a free clinic are scum, and that no one should ever pay for seeing a doctor, (because there are plenty of good doctors that will do the same work for free), but now I've changed my mind.
I'm different, I've already established a following."

That's more how I see it.

 

[SKEETER1]

Juice I tend to disagree

Juice I tend to disagree

As a therapist let me say this....I just dont think U guys dont get it...Of course its great Juice if this Dr works in centers to help the needy but...ask this doctor if he will continue to do this for free...HELL NO...their R some who do this to benefit the needy but they know they have their patients with insurance to whom they can collect on....so this brings me bk to my point....this is Fletchers job and only job...if this was a doctors' only job then he wouldnt be able to support himself as Fletcher wouldnt as well....So use this as a correlation....Do I sense all of us in this forum ...as U have indicated as the needy and he should render his services for free just to us and use his other clients for his $$ making purposes....why should we be called the needy?...We read, coorelate, analize and have the ability to make up our own minds....So if U dont want Fletcher dont pay for it......And again I ask the Dr who treats the less fortunate...what makes U think these people UR treating cant read, analize and come up w/ a job for themselves instead of begging us professionals to give them a freebee when they had the chance to do the same for themselves by getting a high school degree....and then maybe a college degree....dont ask me for favors by (giving U picks"Fletcher") when U could have studied the same material and did it for ur self....

 

[Juice]

But Skeeter, if you don't like people who take free advice, then why would you give free advice in the first place. Are doing it only to try to obtain customers?
Also, this site has always put services (scamdicappers) down, now all of a sudden its endorsing them?

if this was a doctors' only job then he wouldnt be able to support himself as Fletcher wouldnt as well

But this isn't the doctor's only job, he's got a succesfull practice and is doing this out of the goodnes of his heart.
Fletcher, you might say, has a successfull practice but is here trying to help people, out of the goodness of his heart.

Also, I did not write this with Fletcher specifically in mind, and I hate to single him out. I still respect all three of the cappers that decided to do this and I still respect MJ, but I feel that promoting three services was a bad decision and went against everything Mad Jack's stood for.
I'm glad things are getting back to normal as this is still the best site on the net.

 

[fletcher]

jucie let me ask you this and not trying to fight never would with you.
but for the 58 and tips that i pass out that i get from runners from different groups ,and a few select singles do you think i get them for free? well not even close and far from 50 bills,but i only pay if they win so i have laid out some good money for a few years and passed them out here,so its not like i have never gave anything and you are dead wrong the other plays are not lesser they just are not ranked as high but i still played them expecting to win,i dont go to window and say give 701 532 and 518 for a 500 each and say 722 for a dime,well i sure in hell dont want the 3 lesser rated plays to lose and the play that rated out higher to win i want to win them all the might be ranked lesser in terms of my rankings but in terms of strong plays they are all rated to win or i wouldnot be playing them. does that explain it better,i dont even know why this is still going on but as long as it does i will take up for myself not going to be smeered by calling them poor plays or less plays ,they rating is all that is different not the work put in and the expectation is that i hope they all win,do i know if they will no and not 1 person can go back in any thread where i ever said that this game can't lose,or game of the year or lock i know better,just cause i can't type or spell doesnot make me clueless in my choosen field,i choose to do this i could have a coaching job in just a few phone calls and would have one in less then a month in a ball again or college but i choose to do this,some of you act as like i am some skid row scammer that has to do this because i have no choice well i do have a choice and this is what i choose the same way as others could of choose to sign up or not,but not going to go into it again but think what you want there was alot of people that signed up you would be shocked by the numbers because i sure was but i pulled the plug when i saw it was not done the proper way it was kida of dropped in without warning , we didnot think it would be like this and pulled it as quick as we could somethings take time,and all money is being returned and it was a very big amount for such little time,so if we were here to scam then why did i say give all the money back? got of just said the hell with everone else in we will keep running and they can except or move on but i didnot want that,besides what was givien back it did take money to have things set up and also cost to send back,so this wasnot done as a scam,but need to be talked about and done a differnt way and that i and jcak are sorry for,but the ones who lost money are the ones who paid to get this all set up.noone thought about that,well maybe some of you should,jack isnot a bill gates he took a hit in the pocket now,but thats ok because that doesnot effect you guys ,wells here is a news flash it did jack,so keep taking shit and running off at the mouth(not you juice)others but remember this some people lost a sum of money do to eating the investment,to please the majority and it didnot effect anyone but him,the guy who gives you this fourm for free ,it wasnot like he was asking everyone to do something he gave people the choice in 1 small part of his site and if they wanted it the could of made their own mind up but others thought they should think for the ones that did want it insted of saying well its not for me and stay in the free posting fourm and use all the free things but water under the bridge,just remember jack lost money and not one of you self centered people care or even took the time to thank about that,the same guy that paid for super bowl party last year out of his pocket and the same guy who is spending alot out of his pocket this year,how do i know because i set it up,i know what it cost,and 100 bucks a person doesnot get it done,this is vegas at super bowl in a privite meeting room closed party,not the days inn on rt 4 in petty coat junction.

 

[djv]

But Fletch as long as were dropping everything in. Remember this is the same site that twice I believe since I joined. You have said that's it im out and im not coming back. Fletch your still here or should I say you came back. So it can't be all bad. You come back both times. Hell I remember because a bunch of folks dam mear went grazy you had left. You see the influence or power you may have with out even knowing it. Sell your picks sell your idea on capping. No one said No. They just seen it so many places they did not want it here. Heck you got contact all over the place you don't even need this place. Like said above believe you even said that couple times. Fletch I added this in other tread. you have more power then you know. I don't know if that's good or bad.

 

[fletcher]

this was not about me this was something jack wanted to try and ask me about it,so in return he could keep adding new things and up grades,yes he would of made some and i would of also but it was more of a business descion for him,does any one have a clue to what that toy he gave you guys for contest and things cost the trcker,well it a good price tag more then a min wage job for the year,books cannot pay all the money it takes to run a site like this,their advertising $ are streatched already with about 3-4 big sites but arenot getting new clinets from them because most people bounch from site to site,he could keep the for the same and not add thing then it would get stale,hell this change over took alot with this new style fourm about a month ago and he also has people that work for him and put lot of hard work and time in,to give you the best data bases and tools it takes ie alot of time to set up these things hell they could go and do the el chep thing and use stat fox but know it was built to be the best for info and help out there and all this cannot be done with the same income that it did a year ago and like i said people are cutting back in all adds for all types of business,so it also hits the gaming industry also so owners and ceo's need to try to come up with other ways to make ends meet,for those that dont know how much goes into a site i was given a little lesson at a small but very well ran sitew and it takes money and if you are one of the big 3-4 it takes alot of money,and if you can't keep up then doors close that is business and all he was trying was to be able to keep adding new free fetures to use and work good but the money has to come from some where,thats was the big part of this,like i said yes i would of made some but was doing it with jack because he is a friend and i new the reasons why,it was not out of trying to make a quick buck is was to keep adding nice up grades.

 

[Juice]

Fletcher, as I said in my earlier post, I did not mean to single you out (and I'm sorry if it came out that way).
I'm not saying people don't have a right to make money, I just taught MJ's was a bad place to do so.
Heck, if you can make money selling picks, that's great. Just because I do not pay for picks doesn't mean I'm right and people that do pay are wrong. To each his own.
I will say this Fletcher. You seem like a stand up guy. You seem genuinelly concerned for other people's well being. This is evidenced by your numerous posts offering help to members of this community (people you don't even know). I think that's great. I also think that your main purpose for posting here is to help out and not to make money, in fact I'm sure of it. And it also seems that you are pretty well off (I know you don't like to talk about that) and you don't need money from seeling picks.
I guess what I'm trying to say, Fletch, is I really don't think you should try to sell your picks. Its not in your nature. You will get an ulcer from it because you feel bad when people lose money because of the picks. You also feel guilty charging people. I'm sure you do, that is why you kept giving out your picks here for free even though they were offered on your other site as service plays.

I have a satellite dish with a pirated card (stay with me now, I'm going somewhere with this). Every once in a while Direct TV zaps these pirated cards and they no longer work.
There is a guy on the internet that supplies fixes for these "zapped" cards. He takes the time to figure out how the cards were zapped, comes up with a fix and releases it on the net. Anyone can download this fix for free. He doesn't charge.
He does have a PayPal system set up, however, where people can donate money to him as a way of showing their gratitude for all his hard work. And people do. Many times he has come out and publically thanked people for their generous donations.

What do you think?

ps
In my post I have made some assumption about you, none of them offensive I hope, but none the less they are only assumptions, as I don't really know you. I may be wrong on some or all of them, and if I am, I appologize.This is just an opinion I have formed of you based on your 5000 plus posts

 

[fletcher]

i knew you werenot getting on me,had to laugh at the ulcer,hell i took 3 1mg xannax in two hours yesterday,i wanted to choke my screen i dont get upst when i speak on the phone of face to face,only on the field,but its so hard for me to say what i want on a damn screen and hope it comes out right and more or not it doesnot,then i get frustrated at not getting the right point across,then things get all bent out of shape but you have me tagged pretty good my frien.
have a nice night and good work week.

 

[Sportsaholic]

I always thought one of the main purposes of the forum was for SHARING information and ideas on capping. Some people have more avenues available to them, thats great, their choice to share or not. If they feel their work warrents pay, I have no problem with that, but we've all see from time to time new members joining in trying to pitch their services, and what do we hear :nono: :nono: :nono: . So when we see the elder statesmen heading down that same path we look and say :shrug: . I know alot of time and effort is put into your work, and we all apprieciate any input you have on any given game. But thats your choice to share or not. We all cap different ways, and share different ideas, right wrong or indifferent, and thats what makes this forum special.
I commend Fletch for comming back and answering questions, and I also saw JT lurking around the forum yesterday. Hopefully Hoops & JT will stick around. If you feel you dont want to contibute with picks, you can still be a part of the best damn forum out there with capping ideas.
Jack thanks for your work here, it really has helped us all in capping

Now lets get busy sticking it to the man tonight :thefinger