I think we can agree smurph that oil companies certainly don't favor Dems approach of taxing them and setting regs and mandates--I believe if they had power to lower gas they certainly would during this year,don't you?
More Supply/Demand BS
- Thread starter djv
- Start date
The taxes don't add up to much, Dogs. AND - we gotta do something to pay for this crumbling infrastructure.
Dogs - what do you think of this 'keystone' policy of oil companies. if their cost is $0.50, they sell for $1. OK, that's fine, but then when their cost is $2, they sell for $4.
Same operating costs, only now they make $2 profit instead of $0.50. Not only do they not feel a pinch, but they make record profits as price goes up. Every single other segment of our society is hurt, but they just prosper more and more.
Problem is, we don't have choices - they don't have competition. They get all the advantages of being free enterprise - but with a captive marketplace. This is not right.
Then when states like mine make attempts to open up different types of energy for cars - we get sued by oil and Bush's governement and are not allowed to pursue what would spark a competitive, enterprising marketplace.
This whole setup goes against America's supposed sense of free market competition and fair play.
Dogs - what do you think of this 'keystone' policy of oil companies. if their cost is $0.50, they sell for $1. OK, that's fine, but then when their cost is $2, they sell for $4.
Same operating costs, only now they make $2 profit instead of $0.50. Not only do they not feel a pinch, but they make record profits as price goes up. Every single other segment of our society is hurt, but they just prosper more and more.
Problem is, we don't have choices - they don't have competition. They get all the advantages of being free enterprise - but with a captive marketplace. This is not right.
Then when states like mine make attempts to open up different types of energy for cars - we get sued by oil and Bush's governement and are not allowed to pursue what would spark a competitive, enterprising marketplace.
This whole setup goes against America's supposed sense of free market competition and fair play.
Are you telling me you didn't notice the prices drop right before the 2006 and 2004 elections? You couldn't have been this blind.
Not sure about that scenrio Smurph--
Heres the prob you get from media--
Exxon is largest co in the world and has largest revenue--if they only made 1 % profit and continued to grow the media could pound their record profits every year and be accurate--but extremely deceptive at same time as they tout amount of profits to fit their agenda but find one article that tells you what % their profits are per their revenue--you won't find any because it rips the message they are trying to project to pieces.
Here is list of top 50 Forune 500 companies per % of profit per revenue--how many oil companies do you see?? The last figure is profit %
Rank Company 500 revenues
rank 2006 Profits as
% of Revenues
1 Owens Corning 355 125.0
2 UAL 120 118.3
3 Agilent Technologies 387 56.1
4 Anadarko Petroleum 233 44.5
5 XTO Energy 482 40.6
6 Mirant 474 39.8
7 Pfizer 39 36.9
8 Corning 439 35.9
9 Qualcomm 317 32.8
10 Apache 293 30.8
11 Texas Instruments 162 29.7
12 Google 241 29.0
13 Microsoft 49 28.5
14 Chesapeake Energy 325 27.3
15 Baker Hughes 278 26.8
16 Devon Energy 239 26.6
17 Bank of New York Co. 209 25.3
18 Freeport-McMoRan Cpr. & Gld 398 25.2
19 Franklin Resources 445 25.1
20 Phelps Dodge 206 25.0
21 U.S. Bancorp 123 24.9
22 PNC Financial Services Group 231 23.7
23 Oracle 167 23.5
24 TXU 234 23.5
25 Medtronic 222 22.6
26 Occidental Petroleum 124 22.0
27 First Data 331 21.4
28 Coca-Cola 94 21.1
29 Charles Schwab 389 20.9
30 Johnson & Johnson 36 20.7
31 Amgen 171 20.7
32 Wyeth 113 20.6
33 Western Union 492 20.4
34 Cincinnati Financial 484 20.4
35 Comerica 487 19.7
36 Cisco Systems 77 19.6
37 Merck 99 19.6
38 M&T Bank Corp. 496 19.2
39 eBay 383 18.9
40 BJ Services 495 18.4
41 Bank of America Corp. 9 18.1
42 Chubb 176 18.1
43 National City Corp. 188 17.8
44 Wells Fargo 41 17.7
45 Regions Financial 312 17.4
46 Starwood Hotels & Rsrts. 381 17.4
47 USAA 180 17.4
48 Altria Group 23 17.1
49 Eli Lilly 149 17.0
50 Harley-Davidson 369 16.9
Dogs, what in the world are you talking about? So you bold the part of my post that you don't understand, say something about the media, and then spinoff into an irrelevant profit per revenue list from 2 years ago?:shrug:
Will you then explain to me how this quarter all major oil companies broke each other's profit records? Was it just a strange coincidence?
Keep in mind, I'm not playa hatin on success - I'm all for fair free enterprise - my whole life has been free enterprise and competition. But their insane recent profits are not due to success - they are due to a captive market. It's almost like we are back to the late 19th century railroad monopolies.
Will you then explain to me how this quarter all major oil companies broke each other's profit records? Was it just a strange coincidence?
Keep in mind, I'm not playa hatin on success - I'm all for fair free enterprise - my whole life has been free enterprise and competition. But their insane recent profits are not due to success - they are due to a captive market. It's almost like we are back to the late 19th century railroad monopolies.
There has to be games on going. I just don't buy supply and demand changes to tune of gas going up 30 cents in 19 days. And to top it off here in my city 10 cents at a time every 6 days.
couldn't agree with you more...
if the market was truly competitive the prices would vary between the different oil companies....not be exactly alike....
and btw..i blame all of the politicians on both sides of the aisle...
agree, and agreed. I should not call people idiots who try to apply free market economics to the oil industry.
It's just a very frustrating and increasingly dangerous predicament we are finding ourselves in.
It's just a very frustrating and increasingly dangerous predicament we are finding ourselves in.
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Maybe someone can explain to me why the oil companies still "need" ongoing tax breaks for increasing production capabilities and expansion of programs - while at the same time they are showing record profits for quarter after quarter - and continue to maintain that they are being prevented from increasing production capabilities and expanding programs by the government that provides the breaks?
Shouldn't they either give back that money, or at least not use it to add to the profit margins and give to private investors as dividends if they are kept from using it as it was intended?
Shouldn't they either give back that money, or at least not use it to add to the profit margins and give to private investors as dividends if they are kept from using it as it was intended?
it's best to back away when a post gets you mad..that's what i try to do..
agree its a bad predicament that we are in but believe it or not it was a lot worse in the 1970s...in those days gas lines were blocks long (it took hours to get gas), there were certain days you could get gas, & people were getting shot for cutting lines......thankfully there seems to be enough gas for everybody....but who knows how long that will last...:shrug:
we have to have hope that our leaders will come up with something to alleviate the problem...right now that is all we can do is hope..
Well, the administration are oil guys - so I think that explains the tax breaks. :shrug:
i don't follow this closely....so are you saying that the oil companies weren't getting tax breaks before bush took office ?
My local paper/rag had a chart of last 30 days in our city. Prices went from 3.39 to 3.79. Does anyone thing S/D moves that fast 40 cents in a month.
Hasn't been 4 month's since I put this up--:banghead:
--one more time
Exxon's 2007 Tax Bill: $30 Billion
by: Mark Perry posted on: February 05, 2008 | about stocks: XOM
Corporate profits receive a lot of media attention, but what receives considerably less attention are the corporate taxes paid on corporate profits. Do a Google search for "Exxon profits" and you'll get about 8,000 hits. Now try "Exxon taxes" and you'll get a little more than 300 hits. That's a ratio of about 33 to 1.
I'm pretty sure that Exxon's tax payment in 2007 of $30 billion (that's $30,000,000,000) is a record, exceeding the $28 billion it paid last year.
By the way, Exxon pays taxes at a rate of 41% on its taxable income!
[Update: The $40.6 billion and $39.5 billion figures are after-tax profits. For 2006, Exxon's EBT (earnings before tax) was $67.4 billion, it paid $27.9 billion in taxes (41.4% tax rate), and its NIAT (net income after tax), or profit, was $39.5 billion.]
Over the last three years, Exxon Mobil has paid an average of $27 billion annually in taxes. That's $27,000,000,000 per year, a number so large it's hard to comprehend. Here's one way to put Exxon's taxes into perspective.
According to IRS data for 2004, the most recent year available:
Total number of tax returns: 130 million
Number of Tax Returns for the Bottom 50%: 65 million
Adjusted Gross Income for the Bottom 50%: $922 billion
Total Income Tax Paid by the Bottom 50%: $27.4 billion
Conclusion: In other words, just one corporation (Exxon Mobil) pays as much in taxes ($27 billion) annually as the entire bottom 50% of individual taxpayers, which is 65,000,000 people! Further, the tax rate for the bottom 50% is only 3% of adjusted gross income ($27.4 billion / $922 billion), and the tax rate for Exxon was 41% in 2006 ($67.4 billion in taxable income, $27.9 billion in taxes).
--one more time
Exxon's 2007 Tax Bill: $30 Billion
by: Mark Perry posted on: February 05, 2008 | about stocks: XOM
Corporate profits receive a lot of media attention, but what receives considerably less attention are the corporate taxes paid on corporate profits. Do a Google search for "Exxon profits" and you'll get about 8,000 hits. Now try "Exxon taxes" and you'll get a little more than 300 hits. That's a ratio of about 33 to 1.
I'm pretty sure that Exxon's tax payment in 2007 of $30 billion (that's $30,000,000,000) is a record, exceeding the $28 billion it paid last year.
By the way, Exxon pays taxes at a rate of 41% on its taxable income!
[Update: The $40.6 billion and $39.5 billion figures are after-tax profits. For 2006, Exxon's EBT (earnings before tax) was $67.4 billion, it paid $27.9 billion in taxes (41.4% tax rate), and its NIAT (net income after tax), or profit, was $39.5 billion.]
Over the last three years, Exxon Mobil has paid an average of $27 billion annually in taxes. That's $27,000,000,000 per year, a number so large it's hard to comprehend. Here's one way to put Exxon's taxes into perspective.
According to IRS data for 2004, the most recent year available:
Total number of tax returns: 130 million
Number of Tax Returns for the Bottom 50%: 65 million
Adjusted Gross Income for the Bottom 50%: $922 billion
Total Income Tax Paid by the Bottom 50%: $27.4 billion
Conclusion: In other words, just one corporation (Exxon Mobil) pays as much in taxes ($27 billion) annually as the entire bottom 50% of individual taxpayers, which is 65,000,000 people! Further, the tax rate for the bottom 50% is only 3% of adjusted gross income ($27.4 billion / $922 billion), and the tax rate for Exxon was 41% in 2006 ($67.4 billion in taxable income, $27.9 billion in taxes).
