My black lab

[Palmetto Pimp]

Anyones input/experiences would be appreciated

I have a 2 yr old black male lab (louie)...I also have another one...6 months younger than him...no issues with the younger one.
Anyway...a week ago my 5 yr old daughter was watching Louie eat. Louie looked at her, then she pushed his face back towards the bowl to continue to watch him eat---well he bit her pretty hard on the arm...she had sweatshirt on so no broken skin but a bruise for about 1 week. So i thought no big deal...1 time thing and explained to daughter not to bother when eating. So tonight Louie is under coffee table...6 yr old son reaches under to pet him...bites his hand...drew blood...two puncture wounds on 2 fingers...son in hysterics of course.

So.....before I get rid of dog...any advice? Had since 8 weeks old. Basic training. Full bred. All shots.

 

[saint]

That's sad that it happened but it sounds like you know what is necessary.

 

[sportsnut13]

Very surprising for a lab have own 4 of them in my life no problems. I have kids 6 and 3 and trust my dog totally. Could he or she be in heat or sick? Male dog tend to be more unpredictable then females for what I have seen.

 

[Jake DeNiro]

I'm glad to hear that you're going to get rid of him. It would be nice if you could place him in an adult only home with them knowing the dog's past behaviour. Perhaps someone from the training school knows of someone...GL

 

[pug]

You don't say if your dog is fixed. Getting your dog fixed could be what is needed. Male dogs that get fixed usually mellow out a lot. I have two male dogs that used to fight constantly. The vet recommended that I get them fixed, so I did, and have not had any problems since.

 

[Palmetto Pimp]

Both males. The dog with the problem is fixed. Other one isnt...go figure.

 

[INtheBLUE]

Njsf,
I feel for you buddy. I have trained many a dog for friends (mostly australian shepherds) but never a lab. I did have a dalmation once that developed the same habit of property possesion that you are describing. I have a german shepherd / coyote mix (85 lbs) that started to act like she was going to start doing this too so I headed it off while I could.
One or two snaps should be no reason to write off a dog that has a history of being well behaved. It is going to take a lot of work from you though to ensure that this doesnt happen again. Here are some things I would suggest you start doing (and these are all for you, NOT the kids to start doing at first, but then after a couple months of you doing allow the children to do the same practices):
1. While the dog eats pet him on his back using your fingernails and fingertips. Progressively get more physical with this over a week or so. Over the next week, start working your way towards his head, and progressively get more physical with this until you are scruffing him on the head prety good the whole time he eats. If he shows any time of protective nature, take your hand and push sideways HARD against his hip (dont hit, just push hard enough to swing him 90 degrees), swinging him to the side. Its an alpha thing. have your kids stand behind you the second two weeks of doing this, and let them watch exactly how you do it. After the first month, start having one of the children do it with you, but only have them do the back for a while. The dog will get adjusted to the fact that even with 3 people around him and 6 hands all over him, you arent going to deprive him of his primary need.

2. I would be willing to bet a dollar that the under the table incident occured when Louie had atoy that was hiis under the table with him. This is again another property protection hangup that can be fixed. While Louie is under the table, You put you hand flat on his head. Hold a toy or bone up to his mouth and let him grab it. Dont let go of it and start rubbing his head on top and on bottom and all around vigorously while you are still playing tug with the other hand. Do this for about a minute, then let the toy go, but keep your hand on top of his head. When he puts the toy back down, pick it up with free hand, and start over again. Do this at least 5 times in a row. After the 5 times (at least) reward him with small treats while he is still under the table, and your hand is still on top of his head. Repeat for about one week, and it should solve that problem. Louie will get used to the fact that his toys will still stay under the table and he will get treats when the hand comes down under the table.

Although I am a firm believer that physically hitting the dog for some training actually helps them to remember, this is not one of those cases. Do not hit him when he lashes out, it wont help.

I hope this helps out, if not e-mail me with more specific info and I will see if someone else I know that trains problem dogs will help out.

 

[Beebs]

INtheBlue,
Judging by your last response you seem to know a thing or two about dog training. I am thinking about getting a puppy this spring when I have more time to spend putting in the work and I was wondering if you know of a good book that includes not only basic obedience but more comprehensive information concerning man's best friend.
thanks
B

 

[Ronnie]

Good Info Blue! Definitely sounds like you know what you're talking about. I've got a Rottweiler that tends to snap at me and my girlfriend when we try to take her toy away from her. I'll have to try your method and see what happens. Other than that, she is a wonderful dog though. As for njsf, I wouldn't get rid of your dog yet. Give it a little time and work with him, especially if you're attached to him. It definitely sounds like he is a little jealous.

 

[INtheBLUE]

Beebs, I wish I knew more than I do, but You really have to decide what type of dog is best for you?

1.What kind of environment do you have to put the dog in (big or small yard, fenced)?
2.Will you be wanting more than one dog in the future?
3.Any Kids?
4.In house or mainly outside or both?
5.How much time in the day do you have to actually spend with the dog (not just training, but how many hours will the dog have human contact in the future?)
6.What kind of animals do your neighbors have?
7.Do you have any animal allergies now (it does make a difference, some breeds are worse than others)
8.What kind of dogs have you had in the past, what did you like and dislike about them?
9.How much are you willing to spend now and in the future (some breeds will require more money in the future than others)
10.Will you ever want to breed dogs for money?.
11. What area of the country do you live in (climate, some breeds act different if they are in a warm or cold environment)
12.How much patience do you have?

To answer your question, I could recommend books and/or videos to help in obedience and discipline training as well as care, but some groups are better than others in certain breeds. Let me know answers to these questions, and if you already have a breed in mind, I'll try to steer you in the right direction and tell you if that would be a good fit for a happy future for both of you.

Just to elaborate a little, the only major training I have done is for Australian Shepherds training for competition obstacle course work and herding. Which is mostly repetition. I have done some work with voluteer groups for anmal placement and fostering so I know a lot about different animal traits and abilities as well as shortcomings. The main thing that I ever learned was there is a type of dog that is perfect for every human. I like the smart breeds, but they require limit training that makes them learn to guess where they are supposed to do a certain action without ever having been taught to do it.

Example: You let your dogs in the house but you dont want them to go past a certain point in the house and you dont want put up a barrier to keep them there. I learned how to train old and young dogs to do that. If you dont limit train smart dogs, they will be hyper all the time and do whatever they want, go wherever they want, bark at whatever they want, etc......

So I am not exactly an expert but I know a little.

 

[INtheBLUE]

Hey Ronnie, good to see you out and about tonight? Didn't you play Fresno? Great win,huh? Cant wait till Friday Night should be easy money on Rutgers!

How old is your Rotty? Which breed is it? How old?

I may have something better that works pretty well on rottys if its older.

 

[Ronnie]

Yeah Blue, I may add Rutgers as well as the over not sure yet. My rotty is 2 years old and she is mixed with some type of hound because she loves to howl. She was a rescue dog and she is very loyal to my girlfriend and myself.

 

[INtheBLUE]

Well if she isnt full blood and not old, I would try both steps I said above to get rid if that possesion complex.

I may add the over tonight too. BTW, I have Rutgers losing by 8 with a six point varience. (2-14 points). GL tonight.

Visit my pick post when ya get a chance and tell me what you think, I'm adding 2 tomorrow.

 

[Ronnie]

Ok thanks Blue! Heading to girls house now, talk to you on the forum tomorrow and I'll take a look at your college football post.

 

[RAYMOND]

the dog may be sick , the reason why he is biting

 

[THE KOD]

I had a friend with a Chow raised from a puppy.

His four year old was petting him when he was eating. The dog bit her in the face. Took quite a few stitchs.

Take the dog to the vet immediately.
Have it checked out. If not medical problem find another home for the dog or yu may have to put him down.

you cant put your kids in harms way like that.

jmo

 

[Jake DeNiro]

you cant put your kids in harms way like that.

jmo

I agree 100%. Every case is different as far as how the problem is solved. My brother's dog did the same thing with the snapping. He took him to a behaviourlist, did personal one on one training with someone else etc. In short, he tried....Then one day while the dog was on his lead he snapped at someone. That was the first time in 5 years that he snapped at someone while on his lead. He was told he probably wouldn't have if he wasn't on the lead, as he felt he was protecting their space. The person wan't being aggressive towards him or the dog either. No matter what the reason, if a dog snaps once at your kids or someone, I believe and have seen over the years that they will do it again, especially if they have gotten away with it. A dog is a dog and they all have to be watched. I wouldn't like the idea that I have to second guess what my dog might do, especially if there's a chance my kids could be on the other end. I totally believe in the best predicitor of future behaviour is past behaviour. JMHO....GL

 

[worm44]

Scott and jake are right on--no matter what thesituation i dont take any risks with a dog over the kids-its not worth it...the kids will get over the loss of the dog...my opinion....

 

[INtheBLUE]

I agree completely with you guys about the kids and if what I suggested doesnt work, and the dog shows signs of agression again, it has to be gotten rid of. Some dogs cant live with other dogs or kids. Labs usually arent like that, but once a dog has bitten, it makes it easier for it to do it again. Cant see putting him down because, in an environment that doesnt include another dog or kids, the problem might not exist. Some other home might have to be the answer. Dogs are creatures of habits, just like humans. If the dog thinks he has to compete to protect his stuff, he only has one resort, posturing then violence. He isnt attacking, just snapping back to an outside influence. If the dog can be taught that the outside influence is no threat to his possesions, he might never snap back again.

But I stress this, if you do not have the time to put towards training this dog, DO NOT keep him in the house.

 

[THE KOD]

If I did lose the dog, I would get another puppy pretty quick.

gl