Mags,
You?ve added a lot of good information to this thread but I?ve gotta disagree with some of your statements and/or assumptions. Your statements appear to defend the industry you worked in and that?s understandable; however, many Americans like myself believe that single-payer ?Medicare-for-All? healthcare in America would be less objectionable than the runaway for-profit healthcare system we have today.
1. You argued that ?the government pays substantially less to Medicare/Medicaid providers than those providers charge the insurance companies? because the government can demand they do so.?
IMO, that?s precisely why single-payer was the only chance we had to significantly reduce healthcare costs in this country. Unfortunately, Obama issued the insurance industry a stay of execution months ago by giving up on single-payer and, IMO the public option?s on life support as well.
2. You argued that with a public option, ?fewer doctors would go into the field, since payment levels would drop significantly overall and we?d ultimately face a doctor shortage.?
This is an assumption on your part. I could just as easily argue that the vast majority of doctors and nurses enter the field because it?s their calling and they can?t imagine doing anything else. I could also argue that many doctors who?ve left medicine have done so because they?ve grown weary of insurance company bureaucrats telling them what procedures they can and cannot perform and from filling out different forms for over 1300 different private insurers in this country.
3. You said that Obama?s statement that ?Preventative coverage and services save this country money by catching diseases early? is a LIE.
Can you offer some proof that this statement is in fact a lie?
4. You said that Obama?s statement that ?Insurance companies cancel you when you get sick? is a LIE. As evidence, you offered the HIPAA act.
I think you took the statement out of context in that Obama was actually referring to the practice of recission. As recission is a disturbingly growing trend with some insurance companies, in this context, the statement is undeniably TRUE.
5. In more than one post, you argued that ?You must buy insurance BEFORE you get sick/total your car? or the system will never work.
Your auto/health insurance analogy doesn?t work for me. Of course, it?s necessary to purchase auto insurance before you have an accident. For obvious reasons, it has to work that way. However, with health insurance, if no one will insure the sick, what do they do? Why in a country as rich as ours should our tax dollars provide medical coverage for the aged and the poor ONLY? Why should healthcare costs continue to account for more than 60% of all personal and family bankruptcies in this rich nation of ours?
6. You stated that ?on average, 0.5% of policies that are issued to individuals are rescinded due to the person who applied lying on their application?. You then stated that you ?truly believe that the vast majority of insurance companies act with integrity and treat their customers well?.
Just my opinion, but you appear to be somewhat cynical of your fellow Americans and naively trusting of big corporations to me.
7. You stated that Medicare/Medicaid are ?unfunded right now? and that you ?have 0% confidence that the government could run a healthcare system for the rest of us?.
As long as we?re talking percentages, personally, I have EVERY confidence that Big Healthcare, Big Insurance and Big Pharma will continue to raise the cost of healthcare in America to maximize profits for 1% of the population while we, the remaining 99%, continue to struggle to hold on to what?s left of our middle-class lives.
8. You stated that you ?whole heartedly agree that we need a way to help those today who don?t have coverage because they can?t afford it? but that you ?don?t think a government run system is the way to do it?.
What?s your alternative?
Btw Mags, I hope this post didn?t come off as confrontational because that wasn?t my intention. I just think we disagree on some fundamental principles of government and it?s place in our society.
And fwiw, I agree with you completely on your analysis of the Favre saga.
Frenchie:
I have no problem with you disagreeing and having different points of view... what fun would a chat board be if we all saw things the same way.....
And I will be the first to admit, while having a significant background with many of the healthcare issues, that I am certainly biased towards the current system - WITH some important modifications, as I'll agree it is not the perfect system currently.
You had a lot of points to address, I'll try to hit some:
1. Regarding costs - I'm not sure the best method of cost control is on the doctor/hospital side. I've never been a fan of having the goverment dictate prices in any industry. I think that is looking at the wrong end of the snake. Utiliization - due to poor health habits and a fat country, along with prescription drug use due to significant advertising, have more to do with the costs than the overall cost levels of procedures. Utilization continues to rise each year. I really believe consumers need skin in the game and should pay a portion out of pocket for every service, as a way of reducing excessive utiliziation.
2. Tough one to argue - either of us could be right - time will tell on this one.
3. This has been quoted by numerous actuarial sources. I also was reading one of the politiical fact check sites after Obama's speach, and they made the same point. I can't pull a specific reference for you, but I am certain it is true. I'm sure could find this if you searched a bit.
4. SOME companies have taken recission too far, certainly. But I've seen it - there are a lot of people that do not tell the truth - either on their own doing or due to the agent "helping" them. There are some inappropriate recissions to be sure, but the majority of them are appropriate (based on my experience in the companies I've been in).
5. This question comes down to personal responsibility. Who should pay for health care coverage? Should only the rich pay for the entire countries via taxes? Or should everyone be responsible for paying for their own? Personally, I think everyone should share in the responsibility - possibly via a national sales tax? The higher earners (and presumably spenders) would pay more dollars, but the same percentage.
6. I am admittedly biased, but like any industry, you hear the exceptional stories, but do not hear about the other 99.9% of the cases. I have seen misreps that you wouldn't believe on insurance applications. I understand - some people need to lie to be able to get coverage - as they really need it. This is something that we need to address. Coverage needs to be available for all, but not MANDATED for all. High risk pools (a national pool, with costs subsidized by all insurance companies, ERISA and stop loss plans would be a great start).
7. Insurance companies' profits are high because many of the companies are very large. Big companies produce (if run well) big absolute dollars of profit. Many lines of health insurance have a 4-5% profit margin. Most businesses have a higher profit margin than that. But they never quote the profit margin - because people would say "that seems fair". They just quote $XXXX milllion, because it sounds worse. How much do you think Microsoft, for example, makes each year? Big companies = Big profits (hopefully - or our economy will really go into the tank).
I mentioned a couple of alternatives. I also think every child should have government funded health insurance, paid via taxes. Children have no say in whether they are covered - and too many kids are born to parents that have no business raising children and caring for them.
But adults - well, being an adult is being responsible. I wonder how many adults choose not to purchase health insurance (because they can't afford it), but still have a $50 monthly cell phone bill, a $75 cable TV bill, and a big screen TV?????
It's all choices for a lot of us. Obviously not all of us. But our society isn't built on savers and responsible people. Nor on people that take care of their own health (obesity).
Our country is 66% obese, and many people spend like there is no tomorrow.
Again - no problem with your responses, as I do like hearing other points of view. Sometimes, it even gets me to change MY point of view...
