Public hasn't figured out that Avs are the better team!

scrubbo

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Roy has totally outplayed Brodeur and goaltending is the biggest factor in winning the cup. I also agree that the money line on the Avs of +165 is ridiculously high. The Devils seem mentally tired (I think it because preseason hockey starts about a week after the cup ends)and this is causing their inconsistencies. I view this as an even series(with Forsberg i might feel differently)my entire point was that I don't think the Avs are the better team and I still feel that way. I do respect yours and katts opinions and a lot of valid points were made. Good luck the rest of the way.
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Scrubbo
 

Ptarmigan

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The reason I started this post was really in reaction to the outrageous lines coming out of Vegas. I felt that this was mostly due to public perseption of the Devils being so dominant.

After 4 games can we really say who is the better team here? Well, shots aside the Avs have certainly held their own in every game. The same cannot be said of the Devils.

I always respect every opinion on the board and I do want the Avs to win the cup. However, from a capping standpoint, It's hard to lay off these lines from a value standpoint. Keep giving the Devils the edge on the money line and I will continue to bet the Avs. Do you really believe the Avs should be at +160, +170? With or without Forsburg? I don't....

They have been in every game and will continue to either win or make a contest of it.. in a pure $ standpoint it has been profitable to take the avs on everygame so far and I believe it will continue.

Always with respect!

Go Avs!
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scrubbo

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I think the consensus is the same Ptarm. We all think the Avs are the smart money play. When every playoff loss, by the Avs, is by one goal its impossible to pass up such a great money line value. Once in a while you get a couple of fans that need to talk a little smack. No blood, no foul, just fun!!!
GO DEVILS!!!
 

Tlaw

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Hi Fellows, I have followed this board for over a year and respect everyone. I had to jump in on this conversation. I read where someone stated that without the bonehead plays by Blake and Roy the Aves would have won. Did you consider that Blake made a bad play due to the fact that he was fatigued due to the constant pressure applied by the Devils. I am a Ranger fan who lives in NY and I see most Devil games. That is there style, they keep coming at you until they wear you down. They don't have the skill players like the Aves, but you could see last night as the game went on how they hit Sakic everytime he touched the puck and did not allow him many opportunities as the game when on. After the second period, the zamboni didn't have to go down to the Devils side of the ice.


As far as Roy's play, he has been in this league for about 15 years and he done nothing to improve his lack of puck handling skills. Even after almost giving up a goal in game #3, he continued to leave his net. If he wants to handle the puck, let him practice like Broduer, if he doesn't want to practice stay in the damn net. The problem is that he is arrogant and to much into himself. He has already rationalized his poor decision in his mind. He was #2 this past year in turnover behind Zubov. Yet he continues to leave his net and refuses to practice to improve his ability to handle the puck. He has three all star defenseman back there, with all the pressure the devils were applying, he should have stayed in his net. If I was Larry Robinson, I would have the devils drop the puck in the zone to hime every opportunity they get. He will leave his net to handle it, he is arrogant, after blowing the last game he will want to show everyone that he can handle it even though he sucks at it. It all about Patrick. Don't under estimate what he did, it is not just another game. His stupid arrogance, dusted the dirt off of the devils coffin, opened it up and let the defending Stanley Cup Champs have life again. There might be a celebration in NJ this week, but the Aves won't be celebrating. Go going Patrick.
 

Tlaw

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It should say good going Patrick. I just want to add that I do Like the Aves, it just annoys me as a fan to see a player put himself before his team. I have no problem with a goaltender handling the puck, but practice to become proficient in it. Roy sucks at it and refuses to practice to improve. He just gets in the way. Patrick, stay in the net. Take a lesson from Edgar Martinez. As you are great at stopping pucks, he is great at hitting baseballs. However, he can't field worth a shit, so he doesn't go out there.
 

Mr. Promises Delivered

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Oh I agree with you, I have not the slightes clue why Roy continues to try & handle the puck if he isn't skilled at doing it.

When you are going to go leave your net to get the puck, you need to know what you are going to do with it before you get there, not decide when you do & he continues to do that.

I feel it was a bonehead play by Blake for the simple reason he had no business trying to bank it off the boards, he could have gotten away with throwing it down the middle as no one was there at the time.

You have a point, Roy's bonehead play might have just opened the coffin for the Devils but at the same time I'm confident the Avs will get the job done anyway.

I think Roy will have a big game tonight to make up for his stupidity, he usually comes back strong after adversity.

Welcome & I hope you join in on the pick brigade we have here
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selkirk

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I agree that this is a good debate and though on some points people disagree it is a friendly debate, this cannot always be said for topics with over 20 posts. should be a good game.

Blake should have skated up with it some more, and the winger should have been closer to him. I play in a rec league (forward and defense) and you must always support the defense. I think both were at fault.

thanks
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Ptarmigan

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An article from the Denver paper addressing the Roy issue...


Roy takes calculated risk whenever he handles puck

By Derrick Goold, News Staff Writer

Colorado Avalanche goaltender Patrick Roy should have heard, "Play it!"
Instead of the Avalanche's sharp, simple direction that they are supposed to yell when Roy goes wandering from the crease to play a puck, there was no yell, several players said. It is also possible Roy was trying the trickier "Rim it!" but could not see the left winger to make the pass.

Either way, Roy hesitated and the rest is New Jersey Devils' glory.

Devils forward Jay Pandolfo seized on Roy's misplay and dished the bouncing puck back so his teammate, Scott Gomez, could flip into an empty-net, tying goal Saturday in Game 4. New Jersey went on to win 3-2 and tie the Stanley Cup Finals at two wins apiece. It was not the first time Roy was caught straying from the crease, but it did capture a goalie's most difficult decision.

To play the puck and aid the defense.

Or to stay put and avoid leaving a gaping goal.

"You don't want to get caught in no-man's land," said Avalanche assistant coach Jacques Cloutier, a goaltender for 12 seasons in the NHL. "But you don't want your defensemen to get crunched in the boards. If you don't play the puck in the corners they're going to get their head crushed into the boards every shift.

"A goalie has to play the puck."

Devils coach Larry Robinson probably had a good idea Roy's dangerous living behind the net would play into the series. Before Game 1, Robinson, a former defenseman who won a Cup with Roy, said Roy was "terrible" at puck-handling back then. He has improved, Robinson added.

Cloutier said puck-handling was such an important part of his game that he spent 5 to 10 minutes in every practice chasing pucks and flicking passes. When the Devils skaters meet at center ice, their goalie, Martin Brodeur, slides over to a spread of pucks and practices passing. Brodeur, lauded as the best puck-handler, even wears smaller leg pads and uses an average-sized glove to aid his skating and stick-handling, respectively.

Long after most Avalanche players left the practice facility Sunday, backup up goaltender David Aebischer was chasing random dumps by teammate Martin Skoula. Each time Aebischer would leave the crease, corral the puck and either flip it back to Skoula or practice "Rim it!" ? the act of lifting the puck and getting it to coast atop the boards.

Trained in Europe, playing the puck is new to Aebischer and quite difficult.

"My biggest mistake is I play it too fast," Aebischer said. "Timing is a big part of it and you have to be aware of where your teammates are and what you'll have a chance to do. You see how Patrick goes out backward to get the puck. That's so you see the whole ice and how things are developing. I go back sideways and only see half the ice. That's a problem."

Brodeur often has been described by his teammates as a third defenseman. Because he has such a good, strong wrist shot ? remember, goalies wear a baseball-like glove that mostly limits their stick-handling to one hand ? he can whip the puck. Accurate passes sneak past the on-rush of forwards and sometimes gooses the offense for a fast break.

A goaltender's role with the puck has increased through the years as the taboo of leaving the crease has diminished and the need for aggressive defense increased. Roy has improved that part of his game ? because it was necessary.

"It's huge," Avalanche defenseman Ray Bourque said. "You see more and more guys handling the puck in that position ... When you have someone who can step behind the net or go out and stop the puck, it can really release the pressure (on the defense)."

Roy has been caught out of position "tons of times" while playing the puck, he said. He might be caught out there tons more. It is that important to his game and the game.

"Goalies have to go out and get involved in the play," Roy said. "The goalies who don't play the puck are criticized."
 

katts

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Oh I agree with you, I have not the slightes clue why Roy continues to try & handle the puck if he isn't skilled at doing it.

The reason is quite simple.. maybe some of you missed it or is it because the question were asked by a french-canadian reporter before the series start and none of the Americans and rest of Canada heard about it..

Here's what: At the very beginning of the series, someone asks Patrick Roy (translation): "How does it feel to go face to face with the best puck-handler (as a goaltender) in the world?

As you know Patrick Roy has this huge ego and wants to be the best in every field. Never he answered something like "Yes, I admit it, Brodeur is better than I in that field". He actually said that it wasn't that clear that Brodeur is the better goaltender when it comes to puck handling at that he could do just as good. Maybe that's what he wants - to prove that he's just as good - if not better - than Brodeur for handling the puck. That's the one thing that can kill this guy (and his team).. Patrick Roy's ego is so huge that he's gonna make some dumb decisions like that just to prove he's the best of the best - but we all know it: Patrick Roy isn't and will never be the great puck-handler Brodeur is. Hope for him (and his team) he had his lesson in the last 2 games.
 
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