So, what should we do with Iraq at this point?

[smurphy]

All the arguing about reasons for starting this war are somewhat moot. They serve a purpose in that maybe we can learn something for the future, but don't really do anything positive about the current predicament. So what are some ideas about what we should do now? Withdraw? Apologize to the world? Increase our presence to squelch the sectarian unrest? Stay the course, hoping to tread the fine line between control and civil war?

Some things Dogs That Bark made me think more about the responsibility we have to friendly Iraqis who have helped us out. If we withdraw, they will surely be slaughtered. We owe them what we promised. We can't fail them like we did the Shiites after Gulf 1 and the South Vietnamese. We must bear the cross that we voluntarily decided to pickup.

So my solution is one that won't fly - I know that. I'd admit that we are in a war, triple the troops, dig deeper into deficit, draft if need be, and get this thing done. I'd turn Iraq into the 51st state. It's reached that point. I'd outlaw vehicles that get worse than 20 mpg's, I'd force rationing, I'd slash other parts of the budget, I'd slash congress' salary, I'd force our big companies to stay home until we complete this job. ...Basically, I'd admit we planned it wrong and do everything to make victory happen ASAP.

This is why I despise Bush. He didn't plan. Now we're stuck. My solution will never happen. I guess my realistic solution would be to stay the course. We can't let Iraq fall apart. We'll just keep pouring money and people in, but I guess that's better than withdrawing and leaving the friendlies to be slaughtered.

Any other ideas?

 

[CHARLESMANSON]

Apologize for liberating 26 million people???
Apologize for bringing people the right to a democracy??
Apologize for extracting an evil genocidal terrorist who killed 400,000 of his own people???
Apologize for closing Baghdad's rape rooms??
Hell my list could go on for days.


Murph take a look at what we are now finding on Saddam's tapes!! The guy was pursuing nukes!! He was meeting with Al Qaida!!
He was deceiving inspectors!!!
He hid his WMDs!!!

Why are you ignoring the tapes???

It's only been 3 years dude...and look at how far we have come. I know you don't see it that way though because you live in a fantasy world.. You yourself said CNN was a decent network so that goes to show who brainwashed you.

We need to leave decisions like troop reductions and battle strategy to battle commanders on the ground. They are the best in the world. If we left Iraq now like the libs want us to, then Al Qaida will take it over. Not cool. I get my information from people I know in Iraq and it is not the same Iraq that your liberal news outlets say it is. You all want an entire democracy to take place in under 3 years -- good luck I think it took America 11 years. Besides....who would leave in the middle of a war? That's called retreat.

You say Bush didn't plan. This shows me that you have no clue whatsoever as to how a war works. Plans change. Strategies change. You can never predict the enemies next step. You need to adjust. Talk to some millitary experts they will tell you the same thing.

 

[smurphy]

Wow. You don't read entire posts, do you? I was throwing out the varying degrees of options. ......You know what, how about we just stay out of each others' threads. I'll stay out of your 25 threads, and you stay out of my 2. You are way to hyper and unreasonable.

Either that or delete everything except that middle paragraph. That's the kind of literature that can be discussed in a reasonable manner.

 

[SKEETER1]

Couldn't have said it better myself Charles manson........Looks like another Liberal avoids the truth.....anyhow I will say this...smurphy.....You put a picture of a face looking like the Talibon on here......I promise you....If I ever see or meet you ass...You will have your ass kicked.You may say...oh I am expressing my views or freedom of speech.....How dare you...I had friends killed in 911....I will kick your ass if we ever meet!! You an ass for coming on here w/ a pic resembling the taliban.

 

[smurphy]

Did you read my post, Skeeter? What do you get from that which would make you use the liberal label.

I want to triple the troops! I want to admit it's a serious war and get the whole nation to act that way, rather than just say everything's OK.

WTF?

Skeeter - do you have a clue what my avatar is???: It's the Danish cartoon, jackass. You'd have to get in line behind the Islamic assholes to "kick my ass". Jesus Christ. Are you related to Palehose? Care to elighten us about the Contras in Iran?

 

[smurphy]

Tell ya what, big boy. I'll be in Phoenix in the next month or two. You wanna arrange a fight by the parking lot or whatever, just tell me where and when.

Just make it kinda quick and don't leave me limping. There's an awesome strip club on Thomas that has $8 lapdances. I can really stretch my budget at those rates. Pretty good drinks too.

 

[bjfinste]

Smurphy- I agree with Skeeter. Keep that Talibon-looking picture up there, and you have a Grade 1 ass kicking coming your way via me.

Isn't it humorous... it's not even intentional, and yet his reaction is EXACTLY like the Islamic extremists that everyone in here -- both right and left alike -- detest.

On a lighter note, let me know when you'll be in Phoenix if you will be. I'll be there for a few days in early April for the ASU thing. Staying with Brown.

 

[DOGS THAT BARK]

I don't think we need to get a school yard attitude --as we have done pretty well so far--

I interpreted his post more as asking questions than stating opinion--and can see no fault there.

 

[bryanz]

CM, If that is liberation I'm glad I have been never liberated. What do you think of the Vp's meet the press,pre war talk ??????? I voted for bush but I can't defend him. How can you ?????

 

[bryanz]

We can't force our will on the way these people live. Hell we don't have enough troops on the ground to do so. The rape rooms are not closed,democracy is about as close as you and me. Bush said before he was elected, no nation building,that was the last smart thing he said. Yes we have to fight terror but not this way. We should have a sustained air war on these people. Boots on the ground has been and will in the end prove to be a waste of American life. I think the first Bush had it right & was not to far to the right. I know you love that map but when I speak of Middle America, I'm taking about how most of the country thinks. We are not as far right as this Bush or as far left as the Clintons. Most Conservative Republicans would not vote for this guy a 3rd time if given the chance. Our problem is we have two extremist parties in Our Country and most of America doesn't care enough to change it. Most people like you on the far left and right are only concerned about getting and keeping power.

 

[djv]

Article in paper today from Iraqi American Sami Rasouli. He has been here since 85 sold his restaurant in Twin Cities last year and traveled home to visit. Since what he found there was a mess he is traveling America telling what he found. In short went so far as to say it may have been better under Saddam even after leaving Iraq because of his fear of Saddam. He said majority of Iraqis would like the U S troops to leave. Said he was sicken by the bombed out buildings, no water, no schools open for most students. Or schools open with out many books and no chairs to even sit on. Found out so many old friends that had been killed. And that the killing goes on daily. He maybe in one of your area soon. He's traveling the U S telling his story.

 

[kosar]

Couldn't have said it better myself Charles manson........Looks like another Liberal avoids the truth.....anyhow I will say this...smurphy.....You put a picture of a face looking like the Talibon on here......I promise you....If I ever see or meet you ass...You will have your ass kicked.You may say...oh I am expressing my views or freedom of speech.....How dare you...I had friends killed in 911....I will kick your ass if we ever meet!! You an ass for coming on here w/ a pic resembling the taliban.

I didn't think it was possible that there was a bigger f*cking idiot on here than the Manson/palehose/scrabble scribbling 'trio', but i've been proven wrong once again.

A guy has an avatar mocking Islam, suggests we triple our troops in Iraq and finish the war and this clown threatens to kick his ass.

Hey Manson, time to celebrate, you have just improved one spot in the ignorant poll. You are now number 2. (pun intended)

 

[smurphy]

Smurphy- I agree with Skeeter.

I guess I deserve that for not getting your back on Sopranos deal.

Early April no good. I won't have enough time to train for the fight. I don't wanna look like no Muhammed Ali (perhaps the only good 'Muhammed' out there) stumbling around trying for title #4.

 

[smurphy]

I don't think we need to get a school yard attitude --as we have done pretty well so far--

I interpreted his post more as asking questions than stating opinion--and can see no fault there.

I'm very curious what ideas you have for current/future Iraq strategy. DTB. It was you that got me thinking more about the fate of Iraqis on our side if we reduce troops or withdraw. Any ideas?

 

[AR182]

interesting question, murph....

at this junction i think it's imperative that we stick it out.....i know i may be ridiculed for this but i think iraq is too important to just cut & run & yes i do think we can win this fight.....

i would increase the troop presence in iraq & put some of them on the iran & syria borders...... & order them to shoot to kill anybody that attempts to cross into iraq from those 2 countries.....

since i think the media has a very counter-productive adjenda ( i believe they're reporting is all one sided) towards this war i would make it a law that anybody from any media outlet (any country) gets deported out of iraq immediately......& let them back in once the situation is better under control....

skeeter.....

first i thought the picture that murphy has under his name was that of a scottish man dressed in a kilt outfit...shows you what i know....

i think you have the wrong opinion of murphy......sure he is a liberal, but don't hold that against him.....he'll learn....

i have learned from speaking to other madjackers that you become a better person once you are in murphy's presence.....just look how well adjusted kosar & bj have become since they have met the murph........

so what i'm proposing is that when murphy comes to the phoenix area that you, me, him, & whoever else is in the valley at the time to meet up for a few.....and after that if you & him still want to go at it.....i will ref...of course for a price....everything has a price....

so if that is ok for both of you...i will send you both an e-mail.....

murphy is yours still the same...& skeeter if you don't mind i will get yours from jack......

 

[smurphy]

i think you have the wrong opinion of murphy......sure he is a liberal, but don't hold that against him.....he'll learn....

OK OK, this is getting out of hand now. Time and time again I'm labeled a liberal simply because I despise Bush/Cheney, feel the lowest wages should be liveable, treasure the environment, and only want to go to war when I'm prepared to do the whole village.

Based on Dawgball's autobiography and ex-hippies like yourself, I'm starting to think that I am in fact more conservative than folks like y'all. Maybe the carpet doesn't always match the drapes, ya know.

Anyway, your drink idea is a good one.

Regarding Iraq - if you read my first post, you will see that I agree with your strategy. I do not think, however, that the media is at fault. Fault lies entirely with the administration. Only fools would think that the country would support a protracted pre-emptive war. We never have and never will. That's a fact and as long as we are a democracy it will always remain as such. Unfortunately, when we decide we've had enough it will be the friendly Iraqis that pay the ultimate price.

Bush and Cheney needed to read Sun Tzu "The Art of War". It's amazing how accurate simple Chinese strategies from 1000 years ago apply today. For starters, the best strategy would have been to simply keep Iraq strangled. There was no need for invasion at all. When you do decide to go to war - and you outnumber your opponent as much as we do - then you must thouroughly overpower them - leave no doubt. That's why people like Powell and Clark wanted 3 times the forces. As it was, we basically were and are half-assed. Like with Vietnam, we will get tired of the death and mutilation and eventually leave the place a mess. The clock is ticking - the next administration will have to promise significant reductions to get elected.

Bush and LBJ - 2 of a kind. Neither with a concept of the art of war, but perfectly willing to start war, nonetheless. Too bad.

 

[buddy]

What to do with Iraq was concluded nearly three years ago.

 

[gardenweasel]

chill out guys...let`s worry about something that really matters.....

like anne heche`s mental status....

 

[smurphy]

sumpth'n up with Anne? Oh no. Anybody see that movie 'Wild Side' where she totally has sex with Joan Chen. It's incredible - they have unedited grinding sex. Unfortunatley, I saw a few years that HBO cut out basically the greatest ever lesbian sex scene in a non-porn movie. I'm sure there are uncut versions out there though. That was when Anne was better looking too.

Joan Chen - I had a thing for her ever since she sucked the toes of the Last Emporer's wife. ....In fact, that might be the origin of my Asian fetish. ....Either that, or I'm just a normal white guy - in which case I think it's required to have a thing for Asians.

 

[spibble spab]

cant wait to eat sushi off a japanese girl tomorrow.