Change everything? Nothing new is being done.
Fuck, you cry a lot!
Agent Orange votes by mail for Christ's sake!!!!!
Donald Trump suggests delay to 2020 US presidential election
- Thread starter ChrryBlstr
- Start date
Change everything? Nothing new is being done.
Fuck, you cry a lot!
Agent Orange votes by mail for Christ's sake!!!!!
It?s 2020. Wake up.
Colorado has been doing mail in voting since 2013. Oregon since 2000.
Absentee ballots have been in use since the Civil War.
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Debacle: New York?s Mail-In Primary Is *Still* Incomplete ? After Six Weeks
Hotair ^ | 08/03/2020 | Ed Morrissey
As I wrote last week, forget about the arguments on potential fraud. Instead, think of just how badly the New York vote-by-mail primary has been handled from just a logistics point of view, and extrapolate that into fifty states in a general election. The New York Times reports today that the vote count for the June 23 primary has still not been completed, and disqualified ballots are still piling up by the thousands:
Election officials in New York City widely distributed mail-in ballots for the primary on June 23, which featured dozens of hard-fought races. The officials had hoped to make voting much easier, but they did not seem prepared for the response: more than 10 times the number of absentee ballots received in recent elections in the city.
Now, nearly six weeks later, two closely watched congressional races remain undecided, and major delays in counting a deluge of 400,000 mail-in ballots and other problems are being cited as examples of the challenges facing the nation as it looks toward conducting the November general election during the pandemic. ?
Election lawyers said one area of concern in New York City was that mail-in ballots have prepaid return envelopes. The Postal Service apparently had difficulty processing some of them correctly and, as a result, an unknown number of votes ? perhaps thousands ? may have been wrongfully disqualified because of a lack of a postmark.
Thousands more ballots in the city were discarded by election officials for minor errors, or not even sent to voters until the day before the primary, making it all but impossible for the ballots to be returned in time.
Six weeks. For a primary. What happens in a presidential election using vote-by-mail systems that have similar logistics problems? That puts the final first count into mid-December, just a couple of weeks before the deadline for the Electoral College, usually around January 6. In New York, there won?t be much suspense over who won the presidential election (although there might be challenges aplenty in congressional and state races). However, we can expect all sorts of challenges to counts and then to ballots themselves in battleground states where the failure rate of mass vote-by-mail far exceeds the distance between the two presidential candidates.
Suddenly, we?re looking at not just one Florida 2000 situation but potentially several, and this time with much less time to process those challenges. Congress can delay the Electoral College vote, but not for long; the presidential term ends at noon on January 20 by explicit constitutional mandate. If we don?t have a president elected at that time, we also won?t have a vice president, which means the presidency temporarily goes to the speaker of the House ? only we won?t know who that might be, because potentially hundreds of House seats may be up in the air by the time Congress is supposed to reconvene in a new session.
New York isn?t just an outlier either, as Salena Zito pointed out last week. Pennsylvania had the same problems in its primary:
According to data provided by the Pennsylvania Department of State, the number of mail-in ballots was 1,224,215 out of a total vote number of 2,877,749. Traditional absentees were 236,231.
This meant that the number of Pennsylvanians who showed up in person at the polls on primary Election Day was 1,361,231, making it for the first time in this state?s history that in-person voting was eclipsed by votes received by mail. ?
On the eve of the election, Democratic Gov. Tom Wolf, citing civil unrest and a surge in ballots, signed an executive order for six counties to extend the deadline for county election offices to receive absentee or mail-in ballots to 5 p.m. June 9, though they had to be postmarked no later than Election Day itself ? June 2.
The data shows that 15,610 ballots statewide were not counted because they arrived late. A grand total of 37,119 were not counted because either the ballot was undeliverable, the label was canceled for one reason or another, or there was no signature accompanying the ballot.
In 2016, Donald Trump won Pennsylvania over Hillary Clinton by the slim margin of 40,000 votes ? the first time a Republican had won the Keystone State?s electoral votes since George H.W. Bush did it in 1988.
That?s a total of 1.46 million votes by mail combined, with 52,729 failures in both categories. That?s a failure rate of 3.6%, far exceeding the percentage of victory for Donald Trump in all three Blue Wall states four years ago, as well as Hillary Clinton?s margin of victory in Minnesota. The implications of using systems with that high of a failure rate are immense; in an election where 130 million votes get cast, 4.7 million voters can expect to be disenfranchised at a 3.6% failure rate.
That would be a massive disaster for electoral credibility. Nonetheless, Nancy Pelosi wants to go full speed ahead on mass vote-by-mail in November:
House Speaker Nancy Pelosi said Sunday that mail-in voting in the upcoming election will be an essential option for Americans? safety and well-being, despite President Donald Trump?s claims that mail-in voting will lead to fraud and delays.
On ABC?s ?This Week,? Pelosi went on the offensive about Trump?s claims ? noting that the president?s family members, including Donald Trump Jr., advocated mail-in voting for a special election earlier this year in California.
?I know that Republicans know how to do mail-in voting,? Pelosi said.
Fraud?s not the issue, or at least not the pressing issue. The voting system itself has too many points of failure and delay, and introduces too much ambiguity, to produce reliable results. Those risks are present in absentee voting as well, but the normal volume is minimal enough that those failures don?t threaten the overall results. The dry runs of mass vote-by-mail are bad enough to warn all but the most unreasonable away from their use.
If we can go to protests and shop at Walmart, we can vote in person. And all of the data we have in 2020 shows that we must vote in person.
Hotair ^ | 08/03/2020 | Ed Morrissey
As I wrote last week, forget about the arguments on potential fraud. Instead, think of just how badly the New York vote-by-mail primary has been handled from just a logistics point of view, and extrapolate that into fifty states in a general election. The New York Times reports today that the vote count for the June 23 primary has still not been completed, and disqualified ballots are still piling up by the thousands:
Election officials in New York City widely distributed mail-in ballots for the primary on June 23, which featured dozens of hard-fought races. The officials had hoped to make voting much easier, but they did not seem prepared for the response: more than 10 times the number of absentee ballots received in recent elections in the city.
Now, nearly six weeks later, two closely watched congressional races remain undecided, and major delays in counting a deluge of 400,000 mail-in ballots and other problems are being cited as examples of the challenges facing the nation as it looks toward conducting the November general election during the pandemic. ?
Election lawyers said one area of concern in New York City was that mail-in ballots have prepaid return envelopes. The Postal Service apparently had difficulty processing some of them correctly and, as a result, an unknown number of votes ? perhaps thousands ? may have been wrongfully disqualified because of a lack of a postmark.
Thousands more ballots in the city were discarded by election officials for minor errors, or not even sent to voters until the day before the primary, making it all but impossible for the ballots to be returned in time.
Six weeks. For a primary. What happens in a presidential election using vote-by-mail systems that have similar logistics problems? That puts the final first count into mid-December, just a couple of weeks before the deadline for the Electoral College, usually around January 6. In New York, there won?t be much suspense over who won the presidential election (although there might be challenges aplenty in congressional and state races). However, we can expect all sorts of challenges to counts and then to ballots themselves in battleground states where the failure rate of mass vote-by-mail far exceeds the distance between the two presidential candidates.
Suddenly, we?re looking at not just one Florida 2000 situation but potentially several, and this time with much less time to process those challenges. Congress can delay the Electoral College vote, but not for long; the presidential term ends at noon on January 20 by explicit constitutional mandate. If we don?t have a president elected at that time, we also won?t have a vice president, which means the presidency temporarily goes to the speaker of the House ? only we won?t know who that might be, because potentially hundreds of House seats may be up in the air by the time Congress is supposed to reconvene in a new session.
New York isn?t just an outlier either, as Salena Zito pointed out last week. Pennsylvania had the same problems in its primary:
According to data provided by the Pennsylvania Department of State, the number of mail-in ballots was 1,224,215 out of a total vote number of 2,877,749. Traditional absentees were 236,231.
This meant that the number of Pennsylvanians who showed up in person at the polls on primary Election Day was 1,361,231, making it for the first time in this state?s history that in-person voting was eclipsed by votes received by mail. ?
On the eve of the election, Democratic Gov. Tom Wolf, citing civil unrest and a surge in ballots, signed an executive order for six counties to extend the deadline for county election offices to receive absentee or mail-in ballots to 5 p.m. June 9, though they had to be postmarked no later than Election Day itself ? June 2.
The data shows that 15,610 ballots statewide were not counted because they arrived late. A grand total of 37,119 were not counted because either the ballot was undeliverable, the label was canceled for one reason or another, or there was no signature accompanying the ballot.
In 2016, Donald Trump won Pennsylvania over Hillary Clinton by the slim margin of 40,000 votes ? the first time a Republican had won the Keystone State?s electoral votes since George H.W. Bush did it in 1988.
That?s a total of 1.46 million votes by mail combined, with 52,729 failures in both categories. That?s a failure rate of 3.6%, far exceeding the percentage of victory for Donald Trump in all three Blue Wall states four years ago, as well as Hillary Clinton?s margin of victory in Minnesota. The implications of using systems with that high of a failure rate are immense; in an election where 130 million votes get cast, 4.7 million voters can expect to be disenfranchised at a 3.6% failure rate.
That would be a massive disaster for electoral credibility. Nonetheless, Nancy Pelosi wants to go full speed ahead on mass vote-by-mail in November:
House Speaker Nancy Pelosi said Sunday that mail-in voting in the upcoming election will be an essential option for Americans? safety and well-being, despite President Donald Trump?s claims that mail-in voting will lead to fraud and delays.
On ABC?s ?This Week,? Pelosi went on the offensive about Trump?s claims ? noting that the president?s family members, including Donald Trump Jr., advocated mail-in voting for a special election earlier this year in California.
?I know that Republicans know how to do mail-in voting,? Pelosi said.
Fraud?s not the issue, or at least not the pressing issue. The voting system itself has too many points of failure and delay, and introduces too much ambiguity, to produce reliable results. Those risks are present in absentee voting as well, but the normal volume is minimal enough that those failures don?t threaten the overall results. The dry runs of mass vote-by-mail are bad enough to warn all but the most unreasonable away from their use.
If we can go to protests and shop at Walmart, we can vote in person. And all of the data we have in 2020 shows that we must vote in person.
Why the hell would I? If we have been using Absentee Ballots since the Civil War, Oregon has had mail in ballots since 2000 and Colorado has been using mail in ballots since 2013.........WHAT IS THEIR TO FATHOM????
Turn off the right wing propaganda, consider ACTUAL facts, and think for yourself. I assume you're a grown man. Act like it.
Universal ballots........... everyone gets a ballot regardless of whether or not they?re a registered voter.
This could lead to ballots going to people who have moved or who are deceased, and then the ballots could be fraudulently filled out or even sold.
You can go fuck yourself with another one of your scams. Come up with a bonafide policy and run on it's merits.
Now you're changing the goal posts to universal ballots, and you're making up rules that clearly are against the law as your defense. That's brilliant! According to your ridiculous bullshit, mail in voting now means everyone gets a ballot regardless of age, citizenship, or eligibility. THAT'S NOT WHAT ANYONE HAS SAID OR IS SAYING.
Good lord, just keep making it up as you go along. What a clown.
Dude. I'm all for a good debate. But, really, I don't get why you even bother at this point. There are no honest discussions to be had.
Peace!
Dude. I'm all for a good debate. But, really, I don't get why you even bother at this point. There are no honest discussions to be had.
Peace!
Misinformation getting spread without being checked is what got Donald Trump elected. If I have to play Whack-a-Mole in this forum to prevent one more person from falling for this bullshit, it's worth it.
Peace!
Maybe you should just run for president. You might be the best candidate on the ballot if you did, I mean you're right about everything and have the answers for everything all the world leaders don't have, throw your name in this circus cuz hey ya never know...
You should talk.Hype up every issue and promote fear Amplify the misinformation through the media. You're a real cheerleader for America pal.
Nobody who mails in a ballot has their identity confirmed. Nobody checks to see if they?re even a U.S. citizen. Think about that. Any foreign national ? talk about foreign election interference ? can mail in a ballot, and nobody even verifies if they?re a citizen of the United States of America.
But that's OK in your warped world.
Attachments
"Hey Google, how does Mail In Voting confirm identity of the voter?"
- Identity verification: The principal method used to detect and prevent fraud is the mail ballot envelope itself, where each voter must include personal identifying information (such as address, birthday, and driver?s license number or last four digits of a Social Security number). In most states, that information includes a signature that can be used to match against the voter rolls. The voter?s remaining personal information is also matched against the information stored on the voter rolls. As Kim Wyman, Washington?s Republican secretary of state, explained, ?we actually compare every single signature of every single ballot that comes in and we compare it and make sure that it matches the one on their voter registration record.? This is a long-standing and well-established practice to ensure that the ballot received was indeed cast by the correct voter. It?s important to note though that there are best and worst practices with signature matching. When done incorrectly, it can disenfranchise eligible voters. Done correctly ? with signature matching software, bipartisan review by officials trained in signature verification, and outreach to flagged voters ? it is an effective deterrent for fraud.
- Bar codes: Most election jurisdictions now use some form of bar code on their ballot envelopes. These bar codes allow election officials to keep track of ballot processing and help voters know whether their ballot has been received. Bar codes also allow states to identify and eliminate duplicate ballots if a voter casts more than one, whether mistakenly or corruptly.
- Ballot tracking through the U.S. Postal Service: In many jurisdictions, including California, Colorado and Florida, ballot envelopes are equipped with intelligent mail bar codes linked to the postal service that enable voters and election officials alike to track an envelope from drop-off to delivery and processing at the local administrator?s office. Denver?s elections division reported that 17,931 people used its system to track the status of their ballots during the November 2013 election. While relatively new, these ballot tracking systems are now readily available and are easily operable at scale. This way, if a voter says they never received their ballot, states can better determine whether the ballot was delivered, replace the ballot as appropriate, and ensure the original is flagged as compromised and not counted.
- Secure drop-off locations and drop boxes: Multiple ballot return options limit the opportunity for ballot tampering by fostering voter independence in returning a ballot. A common layer of security to ensure that ballots are not stolen or tampered with ? at least for voters who can leave their homes ? is secure drop-off locations. In places where all or most voters receive ballots by mail, many voters do not mail completed ballots; rather, they opt to drop their ballots off at secure polling sites. According to the Survey of the Performance of American Elections at Harvard University in 2016, 73 percent of voters in Colorado, 59 percent in Oregon, and 65 percent in Washington returned their ballots to some physical location, such as a drop box or local election office.
Ballot drop-off locations help maintain a secure chain of custody as the ballot goes from the voter to the local election office. And when drop boxes are put outside of government offices, one security measure is to equip them with security cameras to monitor ballot traffic and ensure that the boxes are not breached. (Drop boxes in government buildings benefit from existing video security systems.) In addition to preventing fraud, secure drop-off locations enable voters to be confident that their ballots will be received on time.
- Harsh penalties: Anyone who commits voter fraud using a mail ballot risks severe criminal and civil penalties: up to five years in prison and $10,000 in fines for each act of fraud under federal law, in addition to any state penalties. In Oregon, for example, voting with or signing another person?s ballot is a Class C felony punishable by up to five years in prison. These penalties provide a strong deterrent to voter fraud; it makes no sense to risk such significant punishment for one additional vote.
- Postelection audits: In 2018, a review of returned absentee ballot records helped identify anomalies in the election results of Bladen County, North Carolina, enabling election officials to uncover election interference by a political operative who stole and tampered with mail ballots. Postelection audits, which many jurisdictions are starting to adopt, would more systematically enable election officials to identify any irregularities or misconduct in the vote. Audits typically use statistical techniques to review a sample of ballots cast in an election to ensure that votes were recorded and tallied accurately. Since audits can only be meaningfully carried out when there is a voter-verified paper record of each vote, mail ballots (which are paper-based), are conducive to effective audits. Postelection audits are already widely used in states that use mail voting and are a best security practice for all elections regardless.https://www.brennancenter.org/our-work/analysis-opinion/false-narrative-vote-mail-fraud
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Fact check:
One of the primary ways voter ID is verified is through the ballot envelope. Most ballot envelopes also have a bar code that lets voters confirm that their ballots have been received and allows states to easily eliminate any duplicate ballots because a unique code is assigned to each voter.
The Brennan Center also says that, in the ballot, "voters must include personal identifying information (such as address, birthday, and driver's license number or last four digits of a Social Security number)," which are used to prevent voter fraud.
About a third of states verify signatures as well and match voter information from ballots to existing voter registration records.
Miller also claimed that the House Democrats' recent stimulus package included a section that barred voter identification. The HEROES Act would change voter ID law around federal elections, permitting a voter to "make a sworn written statement attesting to their identity to fulfill the identification requirement." This would not apply to certain first-time voters "who submitted their voter registration by mail."
Justin Levitt, a professor at the Loyola Law School, Los Angeles, reviewed US elections from 2000 to 2014 and found 31 incidents of voter fraud from that time, during which more than a billion total votes were cast.
https://www.cnn.com/2020/07/31/poli...fication-stephen-miller-fact-check/index.html
One of the primary ways voter ID is verified is through the ballot envelope. Most ballot envelopes also have a bar code that lets voters confirm that their ballots have been received and allows states to easily eliminate any duplicate ballots because a unique code is assigned to each voter.
The Brennan Center also says that, in the ballot, "voters must include personal identifying information (such as address, birthday, and driver's license number or last four digits of a Social Security number)," which are used to prevent voter fraud.
About a third of states verify signatures as well and match voter information from ballots to existing voter registration records.
Miller also claimed that the House Democrats' recent stimulus package included a section that barred voter identification. The HEROES Act would change voter ID law around federal elections, permitting a voter to "make a sworn written statement attesting to their identity to fulfill the identification requirement." This would not apply to certain first-time voters "who submitted their voter registration by mail."
Justin Levitt, a professor at the Loyola Law School, Los Angeles, reviewed US elections from 2000 to 2014 and found 31 incidents of voter fraud from that time, during which more than a billion total votes were cast.
https://www.cnn.com/2020/07/31/poli...fication-stephen-miller-fact-check/index.html
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https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/...identity-is-not-confirmed-for-mail-in-ballots
Stephen Miller Falsely Claims Voter Identity Is Not Confirmed For Mail-In Ballots
Stephen Miller Falsely Claims Voter Identity Is Not Confirmed For Mail-In Ballots
FACTS: The antedote to Republican talking points.
Cricket: "Yeah, but.......but.....but.....but.....".
I wish Jack would start temporarily banning people for posting false or misleading info on here.
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Trump can't decide
Trump can't decide
Which side of his anus he wants to talk out of.
After repeatedly seeking to discredit mail-in voting, President Donald Trump on Tuesday claimed Florida's election system is "safe and secure" and encourages Floridians to vote by mail.
:142smilie:142smilie:142smilie:142smilie:142smilie
https://www.cnn.com/2020/08/04/politics/donald-trump-mail-in-voting-florida/index.html
Trump can't decide
Which side of his anus he wants to talk out of.
After repeatedly seeking to discredit mail-in voting, President Donald Trump on Tuesday claimed Florida's election system is "safe and secure" and encourages Floridians to vote by mail.
:142smilie:142smilie:142smilie:142smilie:142smilie
https://www.cnn.com/2020/08/04/politics/donald-trump-mail-in-voting-florida/index.html
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We are hearing the babble of a narcissistic Game Show Host.
It's What's My Line? meets To Tell the Truth
It's What's My Line? meets To Tell the Truth
I admire your patience and resolve. I gave up trying to help and educate those that are unwilling to learn quite a while ago.
Peace!
