I had a BIG problem with 5DIMES

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Stag

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Jack or IE.........(or anybody else)

was wondering if you could help.

I'v been a longtime member of 5dimes, but something happened over the weekend that is making me consider taking my business elsewhere. I know they are a sponsor on your site, so I'm not sure if I should have just e-mailed you directly or not. Anyway, here goes:

NFC Championship game: It's halftime and I am really liking Philly in the 2nd half. So, during halftime, I log into my account at 5dimes, and see that they offer, as usual, so many different wager options in the 2nd half. You guys know how they put up different alternate spreads and stuff. I love that!

Well, I decided that I would take Philly +7.5 in the second half, despite having to lay -435. Probably not the smartest bet I ever made, but I figured that having Philly (now at +3.5 for the game, since they were leading 14-10 at halftime) was a risk I was willing to take.

So, I want to win $500 on that option on the Eagles for the 2nd half. I wagered $2200 (or something very close to that) to win $500. I would have bet more, but they have a rule where $500 is the maximum payout on a single bet, for a one-minute period, or until the line changes against you.So, my bet was accepted as usual, without any problems, and the money was deducted from my available for wagering amount, and my play was clearly posted in my pending wagers section.

Three minutes later, I log back on to 5dimes to see if I can add any more on Philly. Yes, I could...because it was more than 60 seconds after my first bet and also because the line had changed....it was now up to Plilly +7.5 and -450 for the 2nd half.
So, I made my 2nd play on Philly........this time for like $2250 or $2300 to win $500 . Again, the play was accepted without any difficulty, the money was removed from my available balance and the wager appeared as pending under the "review bets" section of my account. I then logged off the computer and watched the 2nd half of the game on t.v. ....

I was obviosuly very thrilled that Philly's defense dominated Atlanta in the 2nd half, holding the Falcons scoreless and me picking up $1000.

So, get this.....................with about 6 minutes left in the game (and Philly comfortable ahead) I log back onto my 5dimes account.....to see the line for the upcoming NE-Pitt game. I didn't have much money left in my account at the time, since most of my money was tied up in the Philly game, which was still going on. I also had a few pending wagers on some NBA games, and I wanted to see exactly what I had action on (spreads, amounts, etc), so I clicked on "review bets", saw what basketball teams I had wagered on, and also saw my 2 bets for Philly 2H were still correctly pending.

I logged off............and at the 2:00 warning of the Philly game, I logged back onto my account. I went into the "review pending bets" section, to see if those basketball games I won had been credited yet. They were. And that money from the winning hoop games was now put into my "available for wagering balance." But I noticed that my available for wagering was now over $4500 more than it should have been. At first, I was excited! But this is where the problem is....
After seeing this extra $4500 or so in my "available balance", I immediately clicked on my pending bets. THE TWO PHILLY 2ND HALF WAGERS WERE REMOVED.....without any notification, e-mails, phone calls, no types of messages, etc.....The game was down to about 1:30 left in regulation at the time, so I expected the bets to still be pending, obviosuly.
5dimes cancelled the bets.....and put that money I risked back into my account. I was (am) SO pissed.
So....I go to their "live chat" and demand to speak to an operator. I tell them that they owe me $1000 for the 2 Philly wagers....and they take 15 minutes to respond. The lady then tells me that "the special spread was right at +7.5 for the second half............but the juice should have been -600." They said I bet into an obvious "bad line" at -435, and they voided my 2 plays "as soon as they realized this."
Funny, they "realized this" at the 2-minute warning, with the team I wagered on about to cash. I told them...."bad line? if it was a bad line, why did they move it from -435 to -450 three minutes after my first wager?"
She then copied and pasted a statement from 5dimes rules which said something like: "any wager, made in obvious human error by 5dimes, will be cancelled immediately."
Not only was it NOT cancelled "immediately", but how was I supposed to know that -435 or -450 was a "bad line"? And how was I supposed to know that -600 was a "good line?"
Trust me....I am not that smart! I told them "I would have taken Philly at -600 at +7.5 for the 2nd half.......because it was not that big a difference for me." (Probably not good money management on my part...but that's a whole different topic! LOL) The bottom line is that I LOVED Philly in the 2nd half, and was bent on playing them.
5dimes would not and has not responded back to me since and refuses to award me the $1000 I feel I deserve. I am pissed! I don't think it was an "obvious human error at all." Is it my fault they offer tons of exotic and alternative wager options for big games, and couldn't put up a "proper price" here?
I figured it WAS a proper price. Has this happened to anyone else? Do I have a legitimate complaint? I just think it was unfair how they did it.

Thanks for taking the time to read this,
Stag
 
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MadJack

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one, you should have emailed me right away. why wait 3 days and then post this?

two, i can't look into anything until i have your name and account ID so please email them to me.

thanks,

jack@madjacksports.com
 

vyrus858

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Jack im sure he was trying to resolve the case on his own before he came to you, thinking 5dimes would resolve the problem. Stag I feel you man, apexsports did this to me before they went out of business.
 

5Dimes

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Halftime opening and closing prices for all 2nd half options for the Eagles vs Falcons game are as follows:

Open:
Atlanta +2.5 -110
Philadelphia -2.5 -110
Close:
Atlanta +2.5 +105
Philadelphia -2.5 -125

Open:
Atlanta Pick +155
Philadelphia Pick -175
Close:
Atlanta Pick +150
Philadelphia Pick -170

Open:
Atlanta wins game (2nd half line would be Atl -4) +308
Phil. wins game (2nd half line would be Phi +4) -368
Close:
Atlanta wins game (2nd half line would be Atl -4) +315
Phil. wins game (2nd half line would be Phi +4) -380

Open:
Atlanta +3 -125
Philadelphia -3 +105
Close:
Atlanta +3 -125
Philadelphia -3 +105

Open:
Atlanta +0.5 +135
Philadelphia -0.5 -155
Close:
Atlanta +0.5 +135
Philadelphia -0.5 -155

Open:
Atlanta +1.5 +120
Philadelphia -1.5 -140
Close:
Atlanta +0.5 +120
Philadelphia -0.5 -140

Open:
Atlanta -0.5 +175
Philadelphia +0.5 -210
Close:
Atlanta -0.5 +175
Philadelphia +0.5 -210

Open:
Atlanta +2 +114
Philadelphia -2 -134
Close:
Atlanta +2 +114
Philadelphia -2 -134

Open:
Atlanta +6.5 -185
Philadelphia -6.5 +160
Close:
Atlanta +6.5 -185
Philadelphia -6.5 +160

Open:
Atlanta -7.5 +120
Philadelphia +7.5 -140
Close:
REMOVED

Line of Philadelphia +7.5 in the 2nd half would result in getting Philadelphia +3.5 points for the game. The price for Philadelphia to win the game at halftime was between -368 and -380 at the half. A proper line for Philadelphia +3.5 for the game at halftime would have been anywhere from -500 to -700. Laying a price of -135 and -138 when a proper line is anywhere from -500 to -700 is clearly an attempt to take advantage of an erroneous line. The wagers were both voided within 6 minutes of being placed. The second half kickoff occurred at 4:48PM EST.
As much as we try to prevent line errors, they do occur. When posting multiple lines, totals, team totals, quarters, and other halftime propositions, mistakes occasionally occur. Customers who try to take clear advantage of these mistakes will get their wagers voided and possibly have internet wagering shut off on their accounts. This type of wagering activity has been voided in the past and was voided in this case. If a line error like this occurs in the future, it will be voided as well.

Listed below are the details of the wagers, the time the wagers were placed, and the time the wagers were voided.

Funds returned to account:
Sportsbook Result 01/23/05 04:48 PM $1,759.25 $690.00 $2,449.25
Ticket Number Ticket Date Bet Type Selection Line Wager To Win Result Paid Net
3163487 01/23/05 S PHILADELPHIA (2ND HALF) +7? -138 $690.00 $500.00 N $690.00 $0.00

Funds returned to account:
Sportsbook Result 01/23/05 04:48 PM $1,084.25 $675.00 $1,759.25
Ticket Number Ticket Date Bet Type Selection Line Wager To Win Result Paid Net
3163449 01/23/05 S PHILADELPHIA (2ND HALF) +7? -135 $675.00 $500.00 N $675.00 $0.00

Wager placed:
Sportsbook Wager 01/23/05 04:45 PM $1,774.25 ($690.00) $1,084.25
Ticket Number Ticket Date Bet Type Selection Line Wager To Win Result Paid Net
3163487 01/23/05 S PHILADELPHIA (2ND HALF) +7? -138 $690.00 $500.00 N $690.00 $0.00

Wager placed:
Sportsbook Wager 01/23/05 04:42 PM $2,449.25 ($675.00) $1,774.25
Ticket Number Ticket Date Bet Type Selection Line Wager To Win Result Paid Net
3163449 01/23/05 S PHILADELPHIA (2ND HALF) +7? -135 $675.00 $500.00 N $675.00 $0.00


Tony
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Stag

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that's NOT true at all...................unfortunately you can manipulate those numbers, prices, and times any way you want. I know what the truth is...and this is not the truth. You are just trying to cover up what you deemed as a "bad line" at -435. I wasn't born yesterday and I'm certainly not blind.
Please close my account ASAP. It's about ethics.

Jack- I am going to end it here with them, out of respect for you and your site. I know 5dimes is a sponsor of yours. So, I am going to drop it and take by business elsewhere. Not going to bash them.
But, I KNOW what happened, and I am right. But I guess the customer is not always right. I have no proof of this, so unfortunately, that's the way sports gambling (outside of Las Vegas) can work sometimes. The dark side of it.
Thanks for your help, Jack. You have a great website and I will obviosuly continue to post and read and support your other books.

Stag
 

TJBELL

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Stag said:
Well, I decided that I would take Philly +7.5 in the second half, despite having to lay -435.

Looks like the line they have listed (-135 & -138) is a mistake. You have listed -435.

Something is sure wrong.
 

Bill

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How is the customer to know when the line is wrong and why is it the customers responsibility to know this. I would not know that the line was "off". How much does the line have to be off before it is off. Hell 5 Dimes cannot tell you what the line should have been.

5Dimes quote:
"The price for Philadelphia to win the game at halftime was between -368 and -380 at the half. A proper line for Philadelphia +3.5 for the game at halftime would have been anywhere from -500 to -700."


Well there is a huge difference between -500 and -700 so which line woud a customer know to be wrong if you cannot even be specific in retrospect. Why don't you just admit that you screwed the guy and pay him.

My guess would be that had Atlanta covered the 7.5, the guy would have been out $4,500.

MJ has a great site but these Off Shores are always looking for a way to screw you.
And this is not the first issue posters have had with 5Dimes.

5 Dimes = Poor management and Horrible sustomer service. :em38: :liar: :thefinger :thefinger

Stag, I know it makes no difference but I am in total agreement with you and they would have definetly taken your money had Atlanta covered. The ugly side is that unless we have a local or live in LV, we have to deal with these incompentent and/or crooks.

Bill
 

MadJack

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Bill, you're way out of line. "Off Shores" are NOT "always looking for a way to screw you." where the hell do you come off with a statement like that?

jesus, man, you know how many bets are taken from members of this site every minute, every day, every month? now, go search for all the many complaints that are outstanding and see what you come up with. not much, if any, that's for sure.

so, since all these books are out to fuk you, where are all the complaints? you have any idea how many people read this forum everyday? you would think the complaints would be filling all the folders if what you say is true. and, they're NOT!

i don't take sides until i hear the whole story and in this case we have 2 sides saying 2 different things. i'm not sure who is right and who is wrong. i have a good respectable member that has never been a problem or caused problems with any sportsbook and a respectable book that has probably taken millions of bets from readers of this site and there are no complaints.

somewhere, somehow, there ought to be a way to resolve this issue to both party's satisfaction but, who knows, maybe there can't be a resolution. i'll be around to help if needed.

but, for you to come in here calling people liars when you don't know WTF you're talking about is WAY OUT OF LINE.
 

Let's Have Fun

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A proper line for Philadelphia +3.5 for the game at halftime would have been anywhere from -500 to -700. Laying a price of -135 and -138 when a proper line is anywhere from -500 to -700 is clearly an attempt to take advantage of an erroneous line.

How can +7.5 -435 be taking advantage of an erroneous line when 5 dimes in its reply said the line should have been -500 to -700. The difference between -435 and -500 is pretty small in my estimation and as been said how is Joe Gambler to know that the line which was correct did not have enough juice?

No matter who is right or wrong definitely leaves the door wide open to having wagers cancelled willy nilly.

Jack will help, I can attest to that much.
 
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toastonastick

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I haver to side with stag. That was not an obvious bad line. An obvious bad line is having the fav and the underdog mixed up.

I'm not calling anyone a liar, but if thats an obvious bad line then I place a ton of bets that would qualify as a bad line.

I use 5 dimes all the time. I hope this gets resolved! It makes me nervous!
 

5Dimes

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The line that was bet was +7.5 -135 and +7.5 -138, not +7.5 -435 as the player has stated. The bets were voided and the funds returned to the customer's account within 6 minutes of both wagers taking place. The void was done right a kickoff of the 2nd half. The player can confirm the times and amounts involved online by checking the account transaction audit. I have again repasted those same bet details below. As you can see, nothing resembles -435 or anything close. At a price of -435, the bets would have been allowed to stand. At a price of -135 and -138, its a void.


Funds returned to account:
Sportsbook Result 01/23/05 04:48 PM $1,759.25 $690.00 $2,449.25
Ticket Number Ticket Date Bet Type Selection Line Wager To Win Result Paid Net
3163487 01/23/05 S PHILADELPHIA (2ND HALF) +7? -138 $690.00 $500.00 N $690.00 $0.00

Funds returned to account:
Sportsbook Result 01/23/05 04:48 PM $1,084.25 $675.00 $1,759.25
Ticket Number Ticket Date Bet Type Selection Line Wager To Win Result Paid Net
3163449 01/23/05 S PHILADELPHIA (2ND HALF) +7? -135 $675.00 $500.00 N $675.00 $0.00

Wager placed:
Sportsbook Wager 01/23/05 04:45 PM $1,774.25 ($690.00) $1,084.25
Ticket Number Ticket Date Bet Type Selection Line Wager To Win Result Paid Net
3163487 01/23/05 S PHILADELPHIA (2ND HALF) +7? -138 $690.00 $500.00 N $690.00 $0.00

Wager placed:
Sportsbook Wager 01/23/05 04:42 PM $2,449.25 ($675.00) $1,774.25
Ticket Number Ticket Date Bet Type Selection Line Wager To Win Result Paid Net
3163449 01/23/05 S PHILADELPHIA (2ND HALF) +7? -135 $675.00 $500.00 N $675.00 $0.00


Tony
5Dimes Manager
 

beantownjim

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TONY I LOVE 5 DIMES BUT I ALSO HAVE TO SIDE WITH THE PLAYER HERE.I HAD AN INCIDENT WITH (CASCADE SPORTSBOOK) THEY CLAIMED I BET A GAME AFTER IT STARTED MY BET WAS PLACED AT 7.20 AND THE GAME STARTED AT 7.05.I READ CASCADE SPORTSBOOKS RULES AFTER LENNY THE OWNER SAID HE TOOK MY BET AND I LOST 660 DOLLARS,(THERE RULES SAID AND LISTEN TONY ALL WAGERS WILL BE ACCEPTED UP UNTIL THE POSTED STARTING TIME OF THE EVENT) YOU SEE TONY CASCADE STOLE MY MONEY AND BROKE THERE OWN WRITTEN RULES.I DONT KNOW WHAT 5 DIMES POLICY IS ABOUT BREAKING THERE RULES BUT LENNY AND CASCADE SPORTSBOOK TOLD ME IF WE WRITE THE BET IT IS A BET THEY DONT BELIEVE IN BAD LINES.SO TONY I THINK ITS YOUR FAULT FIRE YOUR CLERKS BUT DONT TAKE IT OUT ON THE PLAYER.

TONY LET ME ASK YOU A QUESTION I GOT ROBBED BY CASCADE SPORTSBOOK HOW WOULD 5 DIMES HAD HANDLED WHAT HAPPENED TO ME AT CASCADE SPORTSBOOK.DO YOU THINK ITS O.K. FOR A SPORTSBOOK TO ACCEPT A BET 15 MINUTES AFTER A GAME STARTS AND THEN GRADE THE BET A LOSS AND STEAL A PLAYERS MONEY BREAKING THERE OWN RULES.

I BELIEVE IF A BOOK ACCEPTS A BET THEN ITS A BET AS LONG AS THE CLOCK ISNT INVOLVED LIKE MY CASE.
 

Bill

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Jack, I know they are a sponsor but if the best they can give as a response is that the line should have been between -500 and -700, there is something wrong. I had an account with them three years ago and playing the instant message game with customer support was maddening and extremely time consuming.

Also, just to get the story right, I did not call anyone a liar: I said they were "incompetent and/or crooks." I am not stating which desription best suits them, their customers will have to decide that issue, but to post an "off line", let a customer bet on it twice, cancel the bet without notifiying the customer, and explaning the mistake by pointing out their policy is clearly evidence of an incompetent or a crook. I have dealt with customer all my life and when we screwed up we either communicated personally with the customer or ate the mistake.

I love this site but it is yours and you may ban me for life but i stand by my refelctions and position. :banghead:

You have a tough job in trying to deal with two sets of customers, idiots like me and idiots like 5 dimes. I do not envy your position.

Wonder how many bets they took in on the other side of the "off-line" and if these were also cancelled. Of course we will never know for sure.


Regards,
Bill
 

Bill

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BTJ, it has been a long time since I heard from you. I figured if you are still around as many times as Jack has banned you and multiple threatened life time bans, I have a chance.

Crazy thing this internet communication tool. It lets people say what is on their mind without having to worry about paybacks.

Are you still nuyts or have you gotten better. :mj14:

GL,
Bill
 

Trossi3389

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Bill said:
You have a tough job in trying to deal with two sets of customers, idiots like me and idiots like 5 dimes. I do not envy your position.

bill your post and even mine should not even be here. stag,right of wrong you should of emailed this to jack instead of posting it on the fawking forum. you pretty much put jack on the spot. :rolleyes:

JMO
 

Bill

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Trossi, you are probably right. but I can understand Stag's position and his reaction.

Bill
 

beantownjim

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BOTTOM LINE SPORTSBOOKS HAVE TO DO A BETTER JOB AND HIRE PEOPLE THAT KNOW WHAT THE F-CK IS GOING ON NOT A BUNCH OF BANANA PICKERS.BILL IS RIGHT HOW MANY GUYS LOST MONEY ON THE OTHER SIDE YOU CANT HAVE IT BOTH WAYS AND THE DISADVANTAGE I HAVE AS A PLAYER THE SPORTSBOOK IS HOLDING OUR MONEY SO OF COURSE THEY WILL WIN ALL DISPUTES.

TONY I LOVE 5 DIMES AND HAVE USED YOUR SPORTSBOOK AND HAVE RECOMENDED A GOOD FRIEND OF MINE AND HE LIKES YOUR BOOK BUT STORIES LIKE THIS CANT BE TOLD.JUST PAY THE GUY AND HIRE SOMEBODY TO DOUBLE CHECK THE LINES END OF STORY.YOUR NOT TALKING ABOUT A LOT OF DOUGH HERE TONY AND IF THIS DEADBEAT IS BETTING A LOT OF CHALK YOU KNOW YOU WILL GET YOUR MONEY BACK.

IT SEEMS TO ME OFFSHORE SPORTSBOOKS CAN CHANGE THERE OWN WRITTEN RULES WHENEVER IT HELPS THEM AND SINCE THEY ARE HOLDING THE MONEY THE PLAYER LOSES ALL DISPUTES THIS SUCKS.(EVERYBODY KNOWS LENNY AND CASCADE SPORTSBOOK STOLE 660 DOLLARS FROM ME BUT HOW DO I GET A FAIR TRIAL) :thefinger RHE WHOLE SYSTEM SUCKS WE NEED AN ARBRITRAITOR TO DECIDE THESE DISPUTES
 

LUCKY 7

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Stag,

What 5dimes did to you here is not right. I entered this forum today looking for a new book to put my money in, I read this post and let me say that 5dimes is not going to see a cent of my money. Jack sorry if it sounds like im coming down on a sponser, but many of my friends have been asking about sportsbooks to put their money in for superbowl sunday.......there is no way I will suggest 5dimes after reading this thread. Seems to me 5dimes stands to lose more than $500 in this dispute. Word of mouth can be a bi**h
 

toastonastick

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5 dimes has never done me wrong, always very good to me. But to say that was an obvious bad line is just not right. Issues like this play on everyone when they are choosing a book.

with so many books out there I would be careful to welch on any action.
 
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beantownjim

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LUCKY 7 LETS NOT JUMP THE GUN I AM SURE 5 DIMES WILL RECTIFY THIS SITUATION 5 DIMES IS ONE OF THE BEST SPORTSBOOKS OFFSHORE THEY PAY AND FAST NEXT DAY FED EX OVERNIGHT DELIVERY SO I WILL BACK 5 DIMES AS A SPORTSBOOK.ITS JUST A SMALL MISTAKE ON A LINE 5 DIMES HAS TO STAND THERE GROUND BECAUSE IF A HIGHROLLER PULLS OFF A SCAM FOR 10 DIMES AND NOT A SMALL AMOUNT LIKE BILL THEN WE WILL HAVE A BIG PROBLEM I CAN SEE THERE POINT.I AM SURE 5 DIMES WILL STRAIGHTEN THIS OUT AND I WILL ALWAYS RECOMEND THEM THEY ARE SOLID.
 
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