STUPID AND JUST UNREAL

THE KOD

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I understand this mentality. My grandfather owned land that had a pond on it where he fished all his life. Some people went there and pulled the drain out and it emptied before he knew it. They wanted to get all the big catfish in there.

He was so pissed when he found out about it he went and got his rifle and was going to shoot them. Before that happened he had a heart attack and it almost killed him.

Don't mess with peoples land or dogs.
 

vyrus858

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It's amazing how diverse different parts in the US are...Scott's grandfather almost killed the guys who drained his pond while in California it would be lawsuit after lawsuit then countersuit...Although I am a Bush supporter I just fail to understand why our country decides to shoot (and kill generally) people as a means to an end over and over again like Michael Moore said in Bowling for Columbine
 

THE KOD

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Chan

I don't remember talking about a turkey hunt.

are you making jokes about my grandfather ? Is nothing sacred ?
 

THE KOD

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Chan

how the hell could you remember that ?

wow I am impressed.

The grandfather that took me turkey hunting was on my moms side of the family. He was a avid hunter and fisher of men. The only Dad I knew growing up in divorce. He taught me to be a man.
 

Dogfish

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flletcher-"backwards type clan"?

you being a hunter this suprises me.you should know these camps are not a scene from deliverance movie.but rather a place were law abiding sportsman spend some time with family (sometimes generations) and friends.i have only heard of two killings over tresspassing in my 47 years.vang may have been involed in both.(pleople shot in back in both)

"willing to bet shot fired at him first"?

i will take that bet.i am sure there were racial slurs,as there would have been to me if i wandered onto vangs forty acres into a moung hunting party..dont believe he was shot at first.vangs first story was one of the hunters took his rifle and shot his own friends?this vang is full of shit.

anyway sign me up for the firing squad.wonder how many other killings vang may have been involved in.in non hunting situations on the streets of st.paul.

scott k.o.d.-dont mess with a mans dogs or fish
.
 

Big Daddy

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Posted on Wed, Dec. 01, 2004





Vang faces charges for first time

St. Paul man tells judge he understands counts

BY KEVIN HARTER

Pioneer Press


HAYWARD, Wis. ? Chai Soua Vang, shackled and clad in jail orange, shuffled into a makeshift Sawyer County Court on Tuesday for his first court appearance since being arrested Nov. 21 for allegedly shooting eight deer hunters after a dispute over a tree stand.

Chai Soua Vang, 36, of St. Paul told the judge he understood the charges against him, including six counts of first-degree intentional homicide, two counts of attempted first-degree intentional homicide and use of a dangerous weapon.

Seated between his Milwaukee defense attorneys in the basement of the Sheriff's Department, Chai Soua Vang was silent during the eight-minute initial court appearance and gave only yes and no answers to questions asked by Sawyer County Circuit Judge Norman L. Yackel.

The hearing was held in a basement classroom as a safety precaution with only news reporters and photographers allowed in. Court officials said it was easier to guarantee the defendant's safety at the site, which houses the jail where Chai Soua Vang is being held on a $2.5 million bail.

All of the slain hunters were from the Rice Lake area: Robert Crotteau, 42, and his son Joey Crotteau, 20; Al Laski, 43; Mark Roidt, 28; Jessica Willers, 27; and Dennis Drew, 55. Two men were wounded: Lauren Hesebeck, 48, and Terry Willers, 47.

The judge asked if Chai Soua Vang understood spoken and written English, and he said he did, and what level of education he had achieved. Chai Soua Vang said two years of college.

When the judge asked Chai Soua Vang if he had been "under the care of a psychiatrist or psychologist during the last six months," Steven Kohn, an attorney for Chai Soua Vang, motioned for his client not to answer.

"Your honor, I believe that Mr. Vang is competent based on the conversations that we've had and understands the proceedings," said Kohn, a high-profile defense attorney whose clients have included the prison inmate who killed the serial murderer Jeffrey Dahmer.

Kohn said after the hearing that his statement about Chai Soua Vang's competence related simply to his ability to understand the charges and has no bearing on any possible mental health defense that might be mounted.

The judge asked the attorneys if they were waiving Chai Soua Vang's right to a preliminary hearing within 10 days, which is required if a defendant has failed to make bail and remains jailed.

The defense waived the 10-day requirement, and Judge Yackel then set the preliminary hearing for Dec. 29 at 9 a.m.

Following the hearing, Donald V. LaTorraca and Roy R. Korte, attorneys with the state attorney general's office who will serve as Sawyer County special prosecutors, declined to make any statements.

Kohn and his law partner, Jonathan Smith, whose legal experience includes successfully filing for change of venue, met briefly with dozens of reporters outside the Sheriff's Department following the hearing.

"The legal process has begun today," Kohn said, noting that what investigators have filed so far does not contain all the evidence. "They have put their best evidence forward," he said, as needed to get charges filed. "We are not in a position to respond (today), but will in court to the allegations," Kohn said.

According to the criminal complaint, Chai Soua Vang became lost while hunting on Nov. 21 and climbed into a tree stand. About 15 minutes later, Terry Willers ? who co-owned the land with Robert Crotteau ? approached him and told him he was on private property and needed to leave.

Members of the hunting party say Chai Soua Vang started walking away but then turned and opened fire. Chai Soua Vang says he was fired on first after members of the hunting party yelled profanity and racial slurs at him.

Kohn said the defense expected that if the case were tried in Sawyer County, Chai Soua Vang would get a fair trial, but attorneys would explore all options, including a change of venue. He would not discuss any details of the case, including who was paying for legal fees.

As he had done Sunday ? when Chai Soua Vang's attorneys spoke publicly for the first time in Milwaukee ? Kohn said it was not the time to talk about evidence or legal strategy, but that the attention should remain on the grieving families and their community.

"The focus should be on them, not us," Kohn said.
 

Big Daddy

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The third member of the defense team, James Mentkowski, a hunter who has worked professionally and personally with the Milwaukee Hmong community, did not attend the hearing.

A lone local hunter listened as reporters asked defense attorneys questions. Nathan Hecker, 41, of rural Hayward said he did not know the slain hunters but felt a kinship with them that had prompted him to attend all the news conferences.

"I wanted to see it in person," he said, noting the incident is on everyone's mind and will be for many hunts to come.

"Hunters can be pretty defensive about their hunting grounds, so it could have been pretty heated," he said. "Be that as it may, there is no excuse for killing people."

The shootings have angered many hunters, he said, and increased animosity toward Hmong hunters. He said he understands those feelings but does not agree with them, because every culture "has good and bad people."

Mostly what he has on his mind are the families of the slain hunters, including Robert Crotteau and his son, Joe.

"It made me think of my son and how devastating it would be to my family," he said. "This has me more leery of strangers."


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Kevin Harter can be reached at kharter@pioneerpress.com or 651-338-4414.
 

Big Daddy

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Posted on Thu, Jun. 09, 2005





Judge refuses to move Vang trial

Defense also loses bid to block statements that he shot hunters

BY KEVIN HARTER

Pioneer Press


HAYWARD, Wis. ? Statements made by a St. Paul man accused of killing six deer hunters and injuring two others are admissible evidence, and investigators didn't violate the man's rights during an interview, a judge ruled Wednesday.

Judge Norman Yackel, Sawyer County's only judge, also ruled that the trial for Chai Soua Vang will be held in the county, but it's possible the jury could come from elsewhere in Wisconsin.

The hearing was attended by two survivors and about 30 of the slain deer hunters' family and friends as well as Chai Soua Vang's mother and sister. Among those who attended were shooting survivors Lauren Hesebeck and Terry Willer.

Afterward, Wisconsin Attorney General Peg Lautenschlager, who is representing the state in court, was asked if the judge's rulings were victories for the prosecution.

She said there were no winners or losers, but added that, "our objective is justice be served. And we believe it is good because we will better be able to make a decision."

The judge had scheduled three days to hear six pre-trial motions filed by the defense. But after spending the bulk of the hearing on a motion to suppress statements Chai Soua Vang made to investigators, Yackel made quick work of the remaining issues.

The hearing started promptly at 9 a.m. when a shackled Chai Soua Vang, 36, was brought into the courtroom.

The prosecution started by calling Sawyer County Sheriff's Office Detective Gary Gillis. He testified that on the morning after the Nov. 21 shooting, Chai Soua Vang was read his Miranda rights and agreed that he understood each of them.

The initial interview ended when Vang said he wanted to speak with an attorney, but 10 minutes later he changed his mind and asked for the detective and an FBI agent to return. "He wanted to get his story out," Gillis said.

After about a two-hour interview, Gillis wrote up his statement and went over its seven pages with Chai Soua Vang, who read and signed it.

The statement, made about 15 hours after his arrest, included that he chased and shot some of the victims in the back, according to court documents.

The defense filed a motion seeking to prevent prosecutors from using the statement, arguing that Chai Soua Vang was denied access to an attorney and that his constitutional rights had been violated in the process.

Sawyer County Jail Administrator Lt. Kurt Barthel testified that when Chai Soua Vang changed his mind and asked to see the investigator, he was asked to put the request in writing.

"He wrote down, 'I would like to talk to an investigator now.' I asked if he wanted an attorney present. He said, 'No, I do not.' " Barthel said.

Chai Soua Vang took the stand and testified that at least twice before he met with Gillis, he had asked to make a call and to see a lawyer.

Witnesses called by the prosecution refuted those claims.

Gillis was asked if he had verbally or physically attempted to intimidate Chai Soua Vang. Gillis said he had not.

Gillis said on one occasion during the interview, he may have been stern and used a curse word in telling Chai Soua Vang he did not believe him because the evidence didn't support his statement.

In ruling the statements were admissible, Yackel said, "He readily admitted that he understood what he was doing."

The other pivotal motion made by the defense was for a change of venue.

The trial should be moved because of extensive coverage of the shootings and ongoing court procedures would make a fair trial difficult, said Jonathan Smith, one of Chai Soua Vang's four Milwaukee defense attorneys.

But if the judge ruled to keep the trial in the county, the defense team argued that an out-of-county jury "with some distance" from Sawyer County should be selected.

The defense contended that the trial would surely be delayed if they started and then found an acceptable jury couldn't be selected in the county.

Judge Yackel said the court would be hard pressed to find a county where residents hadn't been exposed to media coverage of the shootings. He noted the shooting happened in Sawyer County, and the victims were from neighboring Barron County.

"Sawyer County people are not emotionally involved with what occurred," he said. "Certainly they have heard about it as have the rest of the state and the country."

But Yackel said defense attorneys could be right, and he would consider the matter before making a decision.

In another ruling, Yackel rejected a defense motion to have one of two counts of attempted murder dismissed.

A Sawyer County judge's rulings on six defense motions include:

? Statements made by Chai Soua Vang to investigators the day after the shootings are admissible.

? The trial will be held in Sawyer County, but it's possible a jury could be formed from outside the county.

What's next:

? The judge will rule on the jury question, likely later this month.

? The trial is scheduled to begin Sept. 12.


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Kevin Harter can be reached at kharter@pioneerpress.com or 651-228-2149.
 

Big Daddy

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Can you believe this ? :rolleyes:





Posted on Fri, Jun. 10, 2005




Vang: 'I live in a bad dream'

Murder suspect expresses regret, lingering anger in newly released correspondence with reporter

BY KEVIN HARTER

Pioneer Press


HAYWARD, Wis. ? Nearly six months ago, Chai Soua Vang says, he dreamed of a violent confrontation in the woods.

A friend woke him from his nightmare at 5 a.m., and he arose in a deer camp in the Wisconsin north woods. Hours later, the dream would in many ways unfold before him and six people would be left dead.

"I have a dream that we're soldiers in the jungle of Laos and I encounter with several Vietnam soldier in the wood, so I shot most of them and some escape to get help," he wrote in a letter dated March 8.

The St. Paul man described that dream and other aspects of his Nov. 21, 2004, encounter northeast of Rice Lake in letters and a transcript made public Thursday. In those communications, Chai Soua Vang expresses remorse for some of the deaths but blames some victims for comments he says led to the shooting.

He is charged with killing six hunters and wounding two in a dispute over a deer stand.

Chai Soua Vang's comments were released a day after a Sawyer County judge sided with prosecutors and declined a defense request to move the trial elsewhere in the state because of publicity and strong emotions in the area. Judge Norman Yackel also rejected a defense motion to suppress statements Chai Soua Vang made to investigators the morning after the shooting.

Yackel delayed a ruling on whether the two letters and phone transcript could be entered as evidence. Chai Soua Vang wrote the letters to Colleen Mastony, a Chicago Tribune reporter who told him she already had interviewed some of his relatives and wanted to write a story for the newspaper.

Six other newspapers, including the Pioneer Press, had requested interviews with Chai Soua Vang, but he opted to speak with Mastony. The handwritten letters filled 14 pages, gave a detailed version of the day of the shooting and outlined Chai Soua Vang's personal life. The transcript is a record of a 14-minute phone conversation Vang had with Mastony on March 14.

In that conversation, the reporter asked how he felt about the victims. He answered:

"Well, some of them I say, I feel sorry about it. Some of them, I said they deserved 'cause they don't know how to talk to me like they should be, ah, shoot me the way they do, so."

Chai Soua Vang also expressed regret.

"Well, right now I wish that this would not never happen so I can be with my family and my work and hopefully things will go well and my lawyer will do it best they can," he said.

The correspondence includes a description of the hunting stand dispute and shooting, but much of Chai Soua Vang's version of events has already been included in criminal complaints. However, the letters give more detail about his thoughts immediately after and in the days following the killings.

After the shootings, Chai Soua Vang said, he ran into the woods, where he remained until about 5 p.m. At that time, he walked out and was taken into custody by a DNR game warden.

As law enforcement officers searched on the land and from the air, he wrote that he pondered what he'd done and questioned his decision to go to Wisconsin to hunt rather than to property he owns in northern Minnesota.

"I thought to myself and said sorry to my wife and family that I have done something to defend myself and my race, but I will disappoint them that I may or maybe able to be with them again. Right now I feel that and wish I wouldn't going hunt at WI and go hunt at my property at north MN. I went to hunt in WI because I got a buck 9 pts during bow season so I couldn't shoot anymore so I decide to go to WI."

Now, he wrote, "? my life in jail here is long days/nights. It like I live in a bad dream only and worry about my wife and family all the time.

"I feel that this incident is happen because people are not able to treated others with respect like they want to be treated and hatred toward other people or race. I'm proud of who I'm, my race and all the people live in this country."

Although the letters and transcript were made public, it's unclear whether they'll be entered as evidence in the trial, set for Sept. 12.

Wisconsin Attorney General Peg Lautenschlager wants to use the correspondence, but Chai Soua Vang's team of lawyers has asked Yackel to toss out the information.

Defense lawyer Steven Kohn said the motion to suppress his client's statements to the reporter relate to the Sixth Amendment, which states citizens' rights in criminal prosecutions.

The reporter's actions were used by the state, Kohn said.

In seeking to have the correspondence entered as evidence, prosecutors called witnesses Wednesday to explain how they obtained the correspondence.

There is one phone in the jail for prisoners to use when talking to attorneys. That phone cannot be monitored because it would violate client-attorney privilege, but all other phones may be monitored, and incoming and outgoing mail may be read.

The phones have red signs advising prisoners that their conversations may be monitored, Sawyer County Jail Administrator Lt. Kurt Barthel said. He made copies of the letters and a transcript of the phone conversation and gave them to prosecutors, who, as required by law, provided the defense with copies.

The judge is expected to rule within two weeks on the question of the correspondence. He'll also decide whether the jury should come from Sawyer County or elsewhere in Wisconsin and how it will be sequestered during the trial.

The Chicago Tribune reporter received the letters months ago, but she hadn't published the story as of Thursday.

Hanke Gratteau, the Tribune's associate managing editor-metro news, said there was no collusion with prosecutors and said the reporter was just doing her job pursuing an interview for a story about Chai Soua Vang and the slayings.

Because the reporter was traveling and using her cell phone, which doesn't allow collect calls, the newspaper sent Chai Soua Vang $100 for stamps and phone cards, Gratteau said. When he used some of the money for personal expenses, the reporter reminded him the money was only to be used for correspondence.


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Big Daddy

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.

In that conversation, the reporter asked how he felt about the victims. He answered:

"Well, some of them I say, I feel sorry about it. Some of them, I said they deserved 'cause they don't know how to talk to me like they should be, ah, shoot me the way they do, so."












WTF????!!!!!! :eek:
 

kame

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Chai Vang's account of shootings
June 10, 2005 VANG0610.LETTER


Editor's note: Chai Vang's account of his encounter with a group of hunters in the woods of northern Wisconsin was recorded in this handwritten letter sent to a Chicago Tribune reporter.

3-8-05

Hunt trip

On Saturday November 20, After I get out work about 1:30 A.M. I got home about 2:00 A.M. I wait my friends Xiong Her to pick me up and wait for Thai Thao, his son Kai Thao and Gorthas from MPLS to Arrive at my house. They all arrived about 2:30 A.M. then we left my house to go hunt near Baldwin, WI. at U-S. Hway 63 and U.S. Hwy 40 met together. We take I-94 to exit 19 on U-S Hwy. 63 N. go aprox. 10 miles to where we hunt that morning. We get there about 3:30 A.M. we seat in a car till 5:00 A.M. then go to our tree stand. We hunt there until 12:00 p.m., but we didn't see anything. So we decided to go hunt near Ladysmith where this incident occur. We left about 1:00 pm and get there around 2-2:30 pm. We take Hwy 40 N. to Hwy 8 East than Hwy 40 E. again to County Rd H N. to Reichael Rd East to taylor R. North to I-94 Trail Dirt Rd North to End of Road. We camp with a group of Hmong in WI. Including my son with them on N. side aprox. 200 yard to death end of I-94 trail Rd. When we go there about 2:00-2:30 pm Saturday. we went hunt about 2 hrs on N. Side of I-94 trail about 1/2 miles [Kodiak?], then we didn't see anythings so we came back to camp to stay with the Hmong Milwaukee Group. We decide to go to Ladysmith because there's more forest and public & more deer in that area. I have hunt there in 2000-2002. I hunt with semi automatic because its easy to shoot the deer when they start moving and quicker to shoot if you miss it first time. When we left my house I ride with Xiong Her and Thai Thao his son with Gorthas in Thai car and also to Ladysmith. We talk about if we don't get any deer this time then we will come back to hunt during the doe season and scope the place very well when we hunt this time. We spend Saturday night social with the Milwaukee Group and talk about where they hunt on Saturday so we can have a better idea to hunt on Sunday. I felt very tired on Saturday night, because I've not sleep all day on Saturday. So after they cook dinner about 9:00 p.m. I ate and drink one Beer that they have, then went to sleep about 10:30 p.m. in the car with Xiong Her. On Sunday morning just before that woke me up about 5:00 AM I have a dream: that we're soldier in the jungle of Laos and I encounter with several Vietnam soldier in the wood. We shot each others so -- I shot most of them and some escape to get help, then later I ran into a Lake, there I was surround by Vietnam soldier Tank and Armor so they take me as a prisoner. Then Thai woke me up. I almost didn't want to go hunt that day, because I never have that kind of dream in my life, but I thought that it's just Another bad dream. So we walk to the End of I-94 trail then Thai-Thoa his son and Xiong Her take the North ATV trail go down the hill so me and son Thao take the ATV Trail go N. East down the hill to the other side of the hill. When we get to the bottom half of the next hill, I left son Thao there and I continue to walk another 10 Minutes along the hill side on ATV Trail. I then walk to the wood west of ATV Trail about 300 yards looking down to the Ridge slop. We walk about 30 minutes to where me and son split up. I sat there until daylight come out, then I saw one doe standing down the slop about 150 yards away. So I shot one time and miss it so the deer start walking North So I shot another 4 times, but miss also then the deer continue to ran on hillside I follow the deer about 1 mile. The deer continue ran North to N. east to the next hill. When I caught up with the deer about 100 yards away on next hill but I'm unable to get a clear shot so the deer run downhill west to another flat lower level. I then caught up with the deer Again about 100 yrds away, but Aprox. 30 yards to the North I saw 2 orange hunter sleep and facing West so I didn't shoot the deer. So the deer ran west to a thick bush. At that time I wasn't sure where I'm at. I know I'm somewhere North of I-94 trail 1? miles from Camp. So I went to talk to that 2 hunters. They were white and get me some direction to go south west, because they weren't sure where we exactly camp at. I continue to walk south west about ? mile until I come to see a tree stand about 50 yards away to west where I standing. I'm facing south at this time. I sat there about one hrs, but didn't see anybody and there's no sign of private property anywhere or fences. So I thought that I'm still in public land, because in Minneosot, we can built tree stand in public land and if nobody there, you can climb to it and wait for deer. So I thought that maybe someone just built the tree stand in public land. That's why I decided to walk to the tree stand and climb on to the stand for a while. I think it was between 11:00-12 pm. I sat on the tree stand about 15 minutes than I saw a man with a Rifle coming from the East next to swamp on a ATV Trail about 125 yards south east of the tree stand. I saw him using a walkie talkie to someone, but I can't hear what he's saying. Then about five minutes later he continue to walk toward me. When he was about 10-15 yard away he ask me what group I belong to so I said my group where somewhere south of here. Then he told me I'm in private land and I shouldn't be in somebody else tree stand. I told him that I'm sorry and didn't know that this's are private property, because I didn't see any fence or sign post anywhere. I then climb down from the stand and walk south east toward public land where he was coming from. I also ask him where is the property line? He told me about 100 yards east here where he came from. When I start walk east I heard him call to someone, but can't hear exactly what he's saying. I can hear people start ATV west about 1/2 miles away, but I continue to walk south east to the ATV trail where they come to stop in front of me about 3 feet away. One ATV is on my right and the other is slightly on my left. There were 3 men on the ATV and 1 on the other. The people on the ATV on right get out from the ATV and two of them come in front of me about 2 feets away. One is in his 40 and the other is in his 20. The one in his 40s where yelling at me "were you on my son tree stand?!! I said yes, I'm sorry I didn't know that was your stand. Then he ask me again. Did you know you were on a 400 acres of private property dam g@@k? I said no. I didn't see any sign post anywhere. He said I don't care, I don't have to put a sign on you [expletive] chinese. He said, I want your [expletive] license. I said no, I don't have to get you anything. He said I'm sick of your [expletive] Asian coming to my land. If you all keep coming to my land, I will kick your [expletive] Asian @$$. I start to walk to my left and start walking south. The young man on his 20's walk in front me and tell me where the hell you think you're going dam g@@k? And 2 others men on the others ATV get out of the ATV in front of me stand behind the young man. I hear they said something with Asian behind him. But I could['nt] hear exactly because he was blocking me. I told him excuse me, I got to go so I go around him on his right to south. Than the man on his 40's tell me to follow the ATV trail and [several illegible words] and never come back again and said matter of fact writing his [expletive]license tag on his back down. I will turn in to the DNR so that that will teach him a lesson. He than came behind me and flip my license tag. At this time the man that confront me come to the ATV so he start write my license # down. As I continue to walk another 20 feet I turn around and the 20's yrs old man follow behind me to the back of the ATV and said to me that I saw you get me the finger. I said no I didn't said anything. I continue to walk another 10 feet.....................
 

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(continues).............. I turn around back and saw the first man that confront me walk in front of the ATV and pull his rifle off his shoulder to his hand and some of the group turn their ATV around face me while some still by the ATV look at me. I continue to walk another aprox 10 feet I look back and saw the man with the rifle that first confront me point his rifle to me so I drop down to a crouch and I hear a fire shot. Then I took off my rifle scope and fire two shot at him. He drop to his right side on the ground. The rest of the group scramble for something at the ATV. So I shot them at the ATV and ran toward them, because I thought that they will get something or gun to shoot me. Some felt to the ground and two take off runing north. When I get to the ATV I shot several time too than chasing those two runing. One take of east on ATV trail. I shot twice he felt to the ground. The other run west north to the cabin yielding help me. I shot several time behind him and chase him near than shot one more. He felt to the ground so I hear someone call to other at the original scense. So I ran back and reload my magazine. When I got close to them another ATV coming and each of them have gun on their should. I duct into a prome position about 10 feet from ATV trail. They went by me and less than a minutes, they come back to the cabin. I switch my orange coat to camaflag color and start run. Than another ATV coming past me and stop about 10 feet in front of me. HE than start take his rifle of from his left shoulder. So I shot several time. They felt to the ground. I ran back to the original scense and one one still sit on the ground next to the ATV. I said you're not dead yet? And shot one time in his diretion. I saw he grab a gun and hide behind a small pile of dirt but I [several illegible words] body on ground still moving. I then started joging away south of the ATV trail. I look back several before ran into the wood. The last time I look back his just got off from the ground look at me so I ran into the wood. Later I throw my bullet into the swamp and later that day turn my self in to DNR. After ran into wood. I though to myself and said sorry to my wife and family that I have done something to defend my self and my race, but I'm will disappoint them, that I may or maybe able to be with them again. Right now I feel that and wish I wouldn't going hunt at WI and go hunt at my property at north MN. I went to hunt in WI because I got a buck 9 pts during bow season. So I couldn't shoot anymore so I decide to go to WI.
My life in jail here is long days/nights. It since like live in a bad dream only, and worry about my wife and family all the time. I feel that this incident is happen because people are not able to treated others with respect like they want to be treated and hatred toward other people or race. [several illegible words] I'm proud of who I'm, my race and all the people live in this country. Some of us Hmong people get lost in the other property. Is not because we didn't respect their land. Some of us are new to the area or got lost. So into other property are everybody including Caucasion as well not just minority only. We didn't hunt anywhere we felt like it. The question is "Are you doing enough to protect your property or family"? For example if you don't put a fence in your front yard and your kids play outside with a ball and the ball run in the street. Your kids was run over by a car and you blame the drive for not careful or bad driver. It's your false that you need to do to protect your property or family, not to one that cause the incident.
 

THE KOD

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Scott-Atlanta said:
mj

agree with you. I can't imagine going into the woods to hunt and then going to jail for the rest of my life. Over a tree stand.

We havnt heard what they said to Vung up in the tree. They could have threatened him, but nothing would allow him to shoot all those people.

Its crazy
........................................................

So these people lose their lives over defending a tree stand.

And the asian loses his family and freedom over
some bullshit.

I pretty much knew it was something like this that happened. I am inclined to believe the asian mans version. Too much macho in the woods with guns.

Private land or not, you don't let things get that far out of hand trying to scare someone that is on your property by accident or lost.

I would have given him a ride on the ATV off my property and wished him well.
 
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Big Daddy

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Posted on Sat, Sep. 17, 2005


Vang found guilty

St. Paul man will serve life in prison for hunter slayings

BY KEVIN HARTER and JOHN BREWER

Pioneer Press


HAYWARD, Wis. ? Ten months after an angry confrontation at a northwestern Wisconsin deer stand erupted in gunfire, leaving six hunters dead, two wounded and an entire community in pain, nine guilty verdicts against Chai Soua Vang brought a sense of relief to families of the victims.

"The verdict of guilty will never bring my brother back, but we can start the healing process," said Linda Lavin, the sister of slain hunter Allan Laski.

"My brother," she said, "never deserved to die."

"Six families were affected, but in the end we were one family," Lavin said.

The jury of eight women and four men deliberated 3? hours before returning the guilty verdicts ? six for first-degree murder and three for first-degree attempted murder.

The convictions call for a mandatory sentence of life in prison. Sawyer County Circuit Judge Norman Yackel will hand down the sentence at a later date.

Chai Soua Vang, a 36-year-old truck driver from St. Paul, showed no emotion as the verdicts were read about 5:30 p.m. Friday.

Many of the members of the families of the victims held hands or wiped tears as the verdicts were read.

As Chai Soua Vang, clad in a green suit, was escorted out of the courtroom, many family members hugged each other. They filled six rows reserved for them during the six-day trial.

Fighting tears, Patti Willers, the wife of Terry, who was shot but survived, and the mother of Jessica, who was killed, said she would always "remember Jess for her big smile." She, and the others, said justice was served by the verdict.

Chai Soua Vang's family had a different reaction as they questioned the racial makeup of the all-white jury and said its deliberations were too brief, preventing a full consideration of the defense's case.

"In less than four hours, my brother's life was taken from us," said sister Chou Vang, referring to the time it took the jury to reach its verdict.

"That's not fair to us. People of the jury do not know how we feel. Every single one of them was white."

Chai Soua Vang's wife, Deu Khang, spoke harshly of the hunters her husband killed.

"I am glad that Chai has the experience to defend himself from these evil people," she said. "They deserve it."

Chai Soua Vang's mother was the last to speak.

She talked in Hmong, raising her voice and pointing to the sky. A family member said that she felt the question about who shot at who first on Nov. 21 was never answered, and she would pray that God would render justice.

Wisconsin Attorney General Peg Lautenschlager, serving as lead prosecutor in the high-profile case, said the jury returned a "just and fair verdict."

The defense team was not surprised at the verdict.

"We had no illusions," said Steven Kohn, one of the Milwaukee defense lawyers. "The facts were incredibly difficult from a defense standpoint."

The judge rejected a defense motion for a change of venue, but agreed to bring an outside jury in from Dane County, where the state capital, Madison, is located.

Chai Soua Vang contended he shot the white hunters in self-defense during the confrontation because they cursed him with racist slurs, threatened him and fired a shot at him. On the witness stand, Chai Soua Vang calmly described how he shot each of the eight hunters and said three of them deserved to die.

In closing arguments, Lautenschlager told the jury that Chai Soua Vang ? angry about the hostile confrontation ? "ran after and pursued every hunter. That is not self-defense."

After the verdict, the jurors declined to meet with the news media or attorneys in the case.

The shootings shocked and saddened Rice Lake and the surrounding area, where all the victims were from. In the days following the deaths, the community banded together with a show of blaze orange ribbons and collections of money for the surviving family members.

The confrontation began when Terry Willers, 42, spotted Chai Soua Vang in a tree stand and told him he was on private land and told him to leave. Five other hunters drove up on ATVs to confront Chai Soua Vang, who had apologized to Willers and was leaving after saying that he had become lost.

Robert Crotteau, who owned the 80 acres with Willers, told Chai Soua Vang to get off the property, using language that Willers and hunting partner Lauren Hesebeck said was profane but not racist. Willers testified that Chai Soua Vang began walking away but suddenly stopped and began firing his rifle, wounding Willers.

In a span of a few minutes, Chai Soua Vang fired at least 20 shots, killing Robert Crotteau, 42, his 20-year-old son, Joseph, Mark Roidt, 28, and two other hunters, Laski, 43, and 27-year-old Jessica Willers, who responded to radio calls for help and were shot off their ATV. Dennis Drew was wounded and died later at a hospital.

Hesebeck was also shot and wounded, but survived.

Chai Soua Vang testified he ran after a fleeing Joseph Crotteau and shot at him repeatedly. Crotteau was shot four times, including a fatal wound to the base of his neck. Four of the slain hunters were shot in the back, according to medical examiners.

All the hunters were unarmed except for Terry Willers, who was disabled when wounded. Hesebeck testified he later grabbed Willers' rifle and fired one shot at Chai Soua Vang, missing.

But Chai Soua Vang testified that Willers fired the first shot and that he feared for his life in the minutes afterward, leading him to shoot repeatedly because he feared the hunters were getting other guns.

When arrested, Chai Soua Vang told police that Terry Willers took his rifle and shot the other hunters and then tried to frame Chai Soua Vang, an inconsistency pointed out by prosecutors.

Many in the Twin Cities Hmong community said they weren't surprised by the verdict.

"My feelings are mixed ? I feel sorry for him, but I think the court did their job," said Kahoua Yang, Lao Family Community of Minnesota vice president. "I think we can put this behind us now and move on."

Kahoua Yang said he doesn't believe Chai Soua Vang was discriminated against during the trial, but wished the jury could have included people of a variety of races.

After talking with reporters about the verdict, the family of Chai Soua Vang walked across the street to the jail and met with the defendant for 45 minutes, said Kurt Barthel, Sawyer County jail administrator. They were separated by glass and spoke by telephone.

Barthel led Chai Soua Vang back to his cell when the family left.

"Under the circumstances, I asked him how he was doing," Barthel said. "He said he was OK. He's accepted it."

Bill Gardner, Mara H. Gottfried and Lee Egerstrom contributed to this report.

Kevin Harter can be reached at kharter@pioneerpress.com or 1-800-950-9080, ext. 2149.
 

Big Daddy

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Posted on Wed, Nov. 09, 2005




Vang to spend life in prison

6 life sentences with no parole for killing 6 Wisconsin hunters

BY KEVIN HARTER

Pioneer Press


HAYWARD, Wis. ? Just before being sentenced to life in prison, Chai Soua Vang called Tuesday the "happiest day of my life."

Sawyer County Judge Norman Yackel sentenced the 37-year-old St. Paul man to the maximum punishment allowed in Wisconsin for the Nov. 21, 2004, shooting deaths of six deer hunters: six consecutive life terms with no possibility of parole.

Calling Chai Soua Vang a "time bomb," Yackel denied him parole eligibility, but he did allow the 40-year sentences for three attempted murder convictions to be served at the same time as his life terms.

After members of the victims' families spoke, Chai Soua Vang apologized to about 10 friends and family members in the courtroom. But he didn't apologize to about 50 of the victims' friends and family, some of whom gasped when he veered from a statement calling for cultural tolerance to praise his work ethic and offer thanks that he no longer has any bills to pay.

"For the rest of my life, I don't have to worry about mortgage payments, child support payments ?," he said. "? I want to thank you. And God bless you."

Chai Soua Vang added, "I understand your anger, your frustration, your grief ? I wish I can change things, but I cannot."

The killings nearly a year ago occurred on the second day of the 2004 Wisconsin deer season following a confrontation over a tree stand on private land in northwestern Wisconsin, according to testimony during a six-day trial in September.

Chai Soua Vang, a Hmong immigrant, claimed that some of the white hunters used racial slurs against him, and that one shot at him before he returned fire. Two hunters who survived gunshot wounds ? Terry Willers, 47, and Lauren Hesebeck, 48 ? denied the accusations, saying that Chai Soua Vang fired first after a verbal exchange that included profanities but not racist epithets.

Left dead were Robert Crotteau, 42, and his son, Joey Crotteau, 20; Dennis Drew, 55; Allan Laski, 43; Jessica Willers, 27; and Mark Roidt, 28. All the victims were from the Rice Lake area.

Clad in an orange jail jumpsuit and looking straight ahead, Chai Soua Vang began his courtroom statement Tuesday by calling for understanding and peace.

"My life is over. But all of you out there have your life, and your journey continues. I hope all of you learn something from this tragedy ? treat one another better," said the truck driver and father of seven.

Wisconsin Attorney General Peg Lautenschlager, who prosecuted the case, said Chai Soua Vang should be judged not by his words, but by his actions. Those included a long, violent history, dating back to high school, that ranged from domestic violence against his first two wives to attempts to force off the road drivers whom he perceived to have shown disrespect.

Lautenschlager said Chai Soua Vang had shown "no remorse or regret."

The families of the victims, who spoke first, told of the suffering Chai Soua Vang had inflicted when he killed the hunters.

Some choked back tears, but each told what it meant to never hear their loved one's voice or see their smile. There would always be an open chair at the holidays, weddings not held and unborn grandchildren.

Bruce Crotteau was the first of the victims' relatives to speak. He was the brother of Bob Crotteau and uncle of Joey Crotteau, both of whom were pursued through the woods and shot in the back, as were Laski and Jessica Willers as they rode on an ATV.

"There is no punishment that Chai Vang can ever receive that will justify what he has taken away," Bruce Crotteau said.

Theresa Hesebeck, the sister of Dennis Drew, said, "As we, the victims of this crime, all of us, went through the trial, we were asked to be composed and respectful as our lives and our integrity were torn apart.

"We watched as Chai Vang, the shooter, actually justified and was excited by his actions. ? Chai Vang has sentenced us, the victims, to our own life sentence and the horrible memories of the deaths of our loved ones," she said.

Heather Kretz, Drew's daughter, spoke of the pain of watching her father, who made it to the hospital, die as she held one hand and her brothers held the other.

"Every morning I wake up to a gaping hole and a sinking feeling that it's not a dream. It's reality. Chai Vang murdered my dad," she said.

Speaking softly, Mark Roidt's mother, Karen, said her only son had been her rudder and anchor, and now she struggles to find her way without his help.

Craig Schuh, Jessica Willers' fiance, spoke of the love of his life, whom he was to marry last July. He has not been able to take down the decorations she put up last November, or remove her personal belongings.

"She was my better half. ? On Nov. 21, 2004, all the happiness was unfairly taken away. No words will ever describe the loss or pain I felt that day and still feel. As a result of Jess being killed, I've been going through the motions just to get by. ? The house we bought was home ? now it is just a house again," he said.

Outside court, Steven Kohn and Jonathan Smith, Chai Soua Vang's Milwaukee defense attorneys, said they weren't surprised by the consecutive life terms.

When asked about his client's "happiest day" statement, Kohn said he couldn't speak for him. The lawyer noted, however, that English is Chai Soua Vang's second language, and he sometimes struggles for words to explain his emotions.

After the sentencing, Lauren Hesebeck said he wasn't surprised by Chai Soua Vang's statements.

"It was like the rest of the trial. What can you make of his statements? They have been all over the board," he said.

Regardless, Hesebeck said he hoped the sentencing would help the community in its effort to heal.

"This is probably the final step to closure," he said. "Now we can move on with the individual things we need to do."

Kevin Harter can be reached at username@pioneerpress.com or 800-950-9080, ext. 2149.
 
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