Won't Change a Dam thing !

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Palehose

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Watch how this does nothing to help the peace in the Mid East ! They are going to get what they want but it wont change a thing stay tuned .


Troops Hand Out Eviction Notices in Gaza
By AMY TEIBEL, Associated Press Writer
3 hours ago

NEVE DEKALIM, Gaza Strip - Defiant and tearful Jewish settlers locked their communities' gates and formed human chains to block troops from delivering eviction notices Monday, as Israel began its historic pullout from the Gaza Strip after 38 years of occupation.

Police and soldiers waited patiently in the sweltering sun and avoided confrontation at the behest of their commanders. One sobbing settler pleaded with a brigadier general not to evict him before the two men embraced.

"It's a painful and difficult day, but it's a historic day," said Israel's defense minister, Shaul Mofaz.

Over the next three weeks, Israel plans to remove all 21 Jewish settlements from Gaza and four from the West Bank. The withdrawal marks the first time Israel will dismantle settlements in areas captured in the 1967 Mideast War and claimed by the Palestinians for their future state.

While Prime Minister Ariel Sharon says the pullout will improve Israel's security, Jewish settlers fiercely oppose the plan and have promised stiff _ but nonviolent _ resistance.

Israeli troops fired in the air Monday to keep back hundreds of Palestinians, including a few dozen masked gunmen, who were marching toward southern Gaza's Gush Katif bloc of settlements in celebration of the impending withdrawal. The crowd burned a cardboard model of an Israeli settlement, complete with an army watchtower.

In Gaza City, the Islamic militant group Hamas hung banners proclaiming the pullout is a result of attacks by militants on Israelis. "The blood of martyrs has led to liberation," one banner said.

Thousands of Israeli troops marched into Gaza's settlements, delivering eviction notices in some communities, but encountering protests in others. The notices gave settlers until midnight Tuesday to leave. If they ignore the deadline, they will be removed by force and could lose up to a third of their government compensation for the move.

Resistance was stiff in Gush Katif. Hundreds of settlers blocked the gates of Neve Dekalim, Gaza's largest settlement, preventing the forces from entering.

Dozens of observant Jewish men, wearing white prayer shawls, held morning prayers at the gate, appealing for divine intervention to block the withdrawal. Dozens of youths wearing orange, the color of defiance, sat on the streets. "Who dares to do battle with God," read one protester's T-shirt.

Troops moved into the community through a second entrance, only to be blocked by large crowds of settlers who burned tires and formed human chains. Protesters formed a ring around the troops, briefly scuffling with one commander who attempted to break through before giving up. The army did not try to force its way in.

Military commanders listened quietly to the settlers' appeals, but said they would not be deterred.

"We will reach every settler, just as we have planned," said Maj. Gen. Dan Harel, Israel's commander over the Gaza region.

Harel told Army Radio that the operation was going as anticipated. "Our estimation is that by tomorrow night most of the residents will agree to leave," he said.

Many of Gaza's 8,500 residents have already left, and Mofaz told the Israeli Cabinet that he expected an additional 300 families to leave on Monday. But the army estimates that thousands remain, including some 5,000 hard-liners who have infiltrated Gaza to resist the pullout. Authorities fear some of the extremists could turn violent.

At the isolated Morag settlement, hundreds of people blocked troops at the gate. One man, identified by Israeli media as Liron Zeidan, burst into tears as he pleaded with officers not to remove him from his home.

"I am not your enemy. I served as an officer under you," the man told Brig. Gen. Erez Zuckerman, the commander of the army unit waiting at the gate.

Zuckerman listened and wiped sweat off his brow, then hugged the young man. "We love you, you are part of us," he told the assembled settlers.

In Gan Or, the army reached a deal with residents to send only a small group of senior officers to give the notices to community leaders in an effort to avoid friction.

The operation went more smoothly in the settlements of Nissanit and Elei Sinai, secular communities in northern Gaza that have virtually emptied out.

In Nissanit, four soldiers came to the home of Yitzhak and Avigail Dadon, a couple in their 70s who said they would leave before the forcible removal begins. Yitzhak Dadon said that earlier in the morning, he lowered an Israeli flag that had been fluttering from his roof. Avigail Dadon cried, and a female soldier stood up to hug her.

Two residents entered an abandoned home, took out a hammer and smashed the remaining mirrors, doors and windows. Some homes were covered in graffiti, including one that read "Sharon is a Nazi."

Soldiers also helped settlers pack. In one Nissanit home, troops removed a large sundeck next to a backyard swimming pool, pulling out planks and stacking them up in a pile.

In the Elei Sinai settlement, resident Esti Yamin clutched her eviction notice and cried. When the four-member army team left her home, she said: "They were very kind and I think they are doing all they can do."

However, one of her neighbors put lawn chairs and a TV set on the roof, where he said he would remain with his young daughter until he is removed by force. "Elei Sinai won't fall," read a large sign outside his home.

Soldiers were also giving eviction notices in four West Bank settlements slated for evacuation. They chose not to enter two of the communities, Sanur and Homesh, where hard-line extremists have holed up. The army instead planned to hand the orders to community leaders.

Israel's Cabinet met Monday and gave final approval for the removal of additional Gaza settlements in what was seen as a formality. The plan was already approved by the government and parliament during a bruising yearlong political battle.

With some 50,000 security forces involved, the "disengagement" from Gaza is the nation's largest-ever noncombat operation.

Palestinian leader Mahmoud Abbas said the Gaza pullout is a "historical moment," but that Israel must also hand over the West Bank and east Jerusalem in the future.

"If they want peace, they must allow Palestinians to achieve their rights," Abbas told the British Broadcasting Corp.

The Palestinians hope the pullout from Gaza will lead to the resumption of peace talks and ultimately full independence in areas captured by Israel in the 1967 Mideast War.

But they fear the withdrawal is a ploy by Sharon to get rid of areas he doesn't consider crucial to Israel while consolidating control of parts of the West Bank, where the vast majority of the 240,000 Jewish settlers live.
 

Master Capper

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Unfortunately, I would have to agree with you but at least it's a start instead of repeating the same vicious cycle over there of air strikes and terror strikes.
 

Marco

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Just another day in the middle east...

Can't imagine how many stories like this are going to come out of all this constitution/democracy facade in Iraq.....
 
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Nosigar

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Nah, things will change. Watch the Pals./terrorists now think they can get anything they want thanks to more liberal engendered appeasement. Basically an escalation of terror for the future.
 

StevieD

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Nosigar, just how is this a "liberal engendered appeasement." Last time I looked the conservatives where in charge of everything and they have been for at least 6 years now. It is one thing to be against the arrangement but how can you possibly blame the liberals for this one?
 
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Palehose

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Nosigar is correct it is due to Liberal's and the Appeasement crowd that Israel has knuckled under and it isn't going to help one bit . Even though Mankind has never been at peace since the beginning of their time and will continue to war and kill each other till the end of our time there are still way to many people that believe we can live in peace with each other hold hands and all meet in Disney World . 60 million people died in WW2 because of the Liberal Appeasement crowd refused to act on 12 years of defiance and broken treaty's from Hitler yet we will continue to not learn from our past and it will happen all over again and again like it has for 1000's of years . Humans overall are dumb animals . The reason the Libs and appeasement folk always get their way is it is just so much easier to not make a stand against people like Hitler ....its just so much easier for people to try and believe things like Hitler has a pact with Holland and Belgium and wont take their country's than it is to send our loved ones into battle to stamp out these idiots . Is that so bad ? no just really dumb . It falls under the same category as parents that believe their kids have been influenced by someone when their kid does something bad its just easier to cope with but untrue non the less .
 

djv

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BS Bush worked this out with Israel leadership. None witch can consider it self very liberal. In fact you have to look hard for liberals there. Democratic reformist yes but conservative to the core.
 

DOGS THAT BARK

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Can't see things getting better--they won't be satisfied--Muslims thrive on confrontation.

Best idea was the wall to isolate them. Look around the world--where Muslims exist so does mass bloodshed.About the only country that keeps them in line is China--and few get in China or want to.
 
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kosar

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DOGS THAT BARK said:
Can't see things getting better--they won't be satisfied--Muslims thrive on confrontation.

Best idea was the wall to isolate them. Look around the world--where Muslims exist so does mass bloodshed.About the only country that keeps them in line is China--and few get in China or want to.

That's an interesting take. Kinda runs directly counter to your views that we have a shot in hell of changing Iraq's whole political system and mindset. If you truly believe the above(and you are correct on your thoughts above), then you should be screaming from the rooftop about our occupation of Iraq. Let's try to be even the least bit consistent.

Garenweasel should be in any time now to call you a racist for not giving Muslims enough credit. Oh, that's right, since you wrote it he won't say anything.
 

LUX

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DOGS THAT BARK said:
Can't see things getting better--they won't be satisfied--Muslims thrive on confrontation.

Islam is nothing but a fvckin plague on the earth. In college, I had to study the Quran, and the idea of a "peaceful Islam" is the biggest lie that those towel-heads have ever tried to pass off. Here are a few excerpts from the Quran:

Sura 9:5 "And when the sacred months are passed, kill those who join other gods with God wherever ye shall find them; and seize them, besiege them, and lay wait for them with every kind of ambush: but if they shall convert, and observe prayer, and pay the obligatory alms, then let them go their way, for God is gracious, merciful."

Surah 2:190-193 "Fight in the cause of Allah those who fight you but do not transgress limits...And slay them wherever ye catch them. And turn them out from where they have turned you out; for persecution is worse than slaughter; But fight them not at the sacred Mosque unless they first fight you there; But if they fight you, slay them. Such is the reward of those who reject faith. But if they cease, Allah is oft-forgiving, Most Merciful. And fight them on until there is no more persecution. And the religion becomes Allah's"

Surah 8:65-70 "God loveth not the treacherous. And think not that the infidels shall escape Us! The shall not weaken God....O Prophet! stir up the faithful to the fight. Twenty of you who stand firm shall vanquish two hundred: and if there be an hundred of you they shall vanquish a thousand of the infidels, for they are a people devoid of understanding....No prophet hath been enabled to take captives until he had made great slaughter in the earth. Ye desire the passing fruitions of this world, but God desireth the next life for you."
 

Palehose

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LUX said:
Islam is nothing but a fvckin plague on the earth. In college, I had to study the Quran, and the idea of a "peaceful Islam" is the biggest lie that those towel-heads have ever tried to pass off. Here are a few excerpts from the Quran:

Sura 9:5 "And when the sacred months are passed, kill those who join other gods with God wherever ye shall find them; and seize them, besiege them, and lay wait for them with every kind of ambush: but if they shall convert, and observe prayer, and pay the obligatory alms, then let them go their way, for God is gracious, merciful."

Surah 2:190-193 "Fight in the cause of Allah those who fight you but do not transgress limits...And slay them wherever ye catch them. And turn them out from where they have turned you out; for persecution is worse than slaughter; But fight them not at the sacred Mosque unless they first fight you there; But if they fight you, slay them. Such is the reward of those who reject faith. But if they cease, Allah is oft-forgiving, Most Merciful. And fight them on until there is no more persecution. And the religion becomes Allah's"

Surah 8:65-70 "God loveth not the treacherous. And think not that the infidels shall escape Us! The shall not weaken God....O Prophet! stir up the faithful to the fight. Twenty of you who stand firm shall vanquish two hundred: and if there be an hundred of you they shall vanquish a thousand of the infidels, for they are a people devoid of understanding....No prophet hath been enabled to take captives until he had made great slaughter in the earth. Ye desire the passing fruitions of this world, but God desireth the next life for you."

They are only fooling the Liberals Lux !
 
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kosar

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Palehose said:
They are only fooling the Liberals Lux !

lol-who, exactly, is being 'fooled' in Iraq?

Same question as before. How is it that the muslims are hopelessly brutal and violent and it will never change in Palestine, yet you guys do a 180 about Iraq?

Regarding Iraq, when some of us say it's hopeless, we get attacked.

Reconcile that please.

How are the muslims so much more workable in Iraq, but a hopeless cause in Palestine?

And hey! Where is gardenweasel? Usually by now he'd be blowing in and calling everybody racist.
 

LUX

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Agreed Kosar. Muslims have the sole intent to bring the world under the submission of Islam through violence and terrorism. The widespread naivety of Islam in western nations will only serve to place us in the position of sitting ducks for the bloodthirsty muslims. We shouldn't continue fostering the sophomoric idea of a peaceful Islam - it hasn't ever existed, it doesn't exist now, and it will never exist.
 

kosar

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LUX said:
Agreed Kosar. Muslims have the sole intent to bring the world under the submission of Islam through violence and terrorism. The widespread naivety of Islam in western nations will only serve to place us in the position of sitting ducks for the bloodthirsty muslims. We shouldn't continue fostering the sophomoric idea of a peaceful Islam - it hasn't ever existed, it doesn't exist now, and it will never exist.

dtb, Palehose and others, let me introduce you to a concept that's totally foreign to you guys: consistency.

See, Lux leans right, at least that's what i've gathered from his few posts, but he's being consistent. He's not just spitting back what Bush tells him. Or backing up everything Bush does. Or thinking that this abortion in Iraq is a virtuous fight with any chance of succeeding, yet Gaza is hopeless.

It's ok to think for yourselves once in a while.
 

smurphy

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I agree with the "consistent" conservatives. Islam is bad, mmkay. That's whay I use as little petrol as possible and taunt Allah as much as possible.

You snagged DTB in a bit of a catch-22 there, Kosar. Nicely done.

I see we had some horrific bombings from Islamists in Bangladesh yesterday. Look for that Indonesian region of the world to become increasingly hostile in coming years.

Yet, we CONTINUE to do everything in our power to make the Saudi arseholes as wealthy as possible and let our economy and foreign policy be dictated by their wonderful product.

Maybe the neocons know best - maybe we are better off ignoring the obvious and spend our time bashing grieving parents of dead soldiers, and presidents who've been out of office for 5 years. It's a more comforting to deal with our own current failures that way.
 

Palehose

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kosar said:
lol-who, exactly, is being 'fooled' in Iraq?

Same question as before. How is it that the muslims are hopelessly brutal and violent and it will never change in Palestine, yet you guys do a 180 about Iraq?

Regarding Iraq, when some of us say it's hopeless, we get attacked.

Reconcile that please.

How are the muslims so much more workable in Iraq, but a hopeless cause in Palestine?

And hey! Where is gardenweasel? Usually by now he'd be blowing in and calling everybody racist.

You just dont get it do you ? 2 choices here as far as I am concerned :

1. We change Isamic states to democracy's and hope Islam plays a much smaller part in these peoples lives IE: stop the Clerics from making their laws and maybe they will become more passive ...dam maybe they even change the wording of the Koran like many other religions have to make it less violent ( I know this probably wont happen due to the nature of the Koran ) but they could become more pasive reguardless of the wording if they embrace democracy .

2. We can go to war with what ...almost 2 billion people and wipe them from earth before they convert us .

its really that simple ...I know what my choice is how about yours ?
 

Palehose

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kosar said:
dtb, Palehose and others, let me introduce you to a concept that's totally foreign to you guys: consistency.

See, Lux leans right, at least that's what i've gathered from his few posts, but he's being consistent. He's not just spitting back what Bush tells him. Or backing up everything Bush does. Or thinking that this abortion in Iraq is a virtuous fight with any chance of succeeding, yet Gaza is hopeless.

It's ok to think for yourselves once in a while.


Hahahaha your funny and you dont comprehend well when reading !

Bush sucks ...way too liberal on domestic policy's in light of current affairs a true Conservative would deport every Muslim in this country and close the borders !At least stop the immigration from the Mid East .

I will never back Bush even 90% of the Time unfortunately my other choice is the wacko liberal Democrats and that just wont ever happen .

Things I dont agree with Bush on or Conservatives for that matter :

Everything Bush says or does domestically 90% of the time .
Abortion
Drugs ( lets face it nobody in their right mind can tell me Alcohol should be leagal and Pot Illeagal )
Our Tax System ( I want no income Tax but high sales Tax ...fairest tax possible )
thats the short list .
 
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LUX

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Islam is a death cult, and there is no such thing as the asinine idea of it playing a much smaller part in these peoples - It is their entire life! The terrorists aren't just a handful of crazy "extremist" muslims. ALL muslims are hate-filled people who live by the quran, which means they believe in and support all the death, murder and terrorism. Their daily prayers include praying for success of the "martyrs" and the worldwide conquest of Islam. In Islam, each individual views themselves as having a "job" to do in allah's name. Many of them believe their job is to lie low and foster an idea of "peaceful" muslims who are "non-violent" and not a threat. They understand that they must convince the world that Islam is good, while those whose "job" involves jihad must carry out the war and bloodbath. Islam is not a real religion, it is a religious terrorist war machine - there IS a difference. The US should no longer recognize Islam as a religion and then it could be outlawed.
 

Palehose

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LUX said:
Islam is a death cult, and there is no such thing as the asinine idea of it playing a much smaller part in these peoples - It is their entire life! The terrorists aren't just a handful of crazy "extremist" muslims. ALL muslims are hate-filled people who live by the quran, which means they believe in and support all the death, murder and terrorism. Their daily prayers include praying for success of the "martyrs" and the worldwide conquest of Islam. In Islam, each individual views themselves as having a "job" to do in allah's name. Many of them believe their job is to lie low and foster an idea of "peaceful" muslims who are "non-violent" and not a threat. They understand that they must convince the world that Islam is good, while those whose "job" involves jihad must carry out the war and bloodbath. Islam is not a real religion, it is a religious terrorist war machine - there IS a difference. The US should no longer recognize Islam as a religion and then it could be outlawed.

I only hold hope because so many other Religions have embraced violence in the past ...so be it hundreds of years ago ...but violent none the less and they became much more passive . I do think if we can keep the dam Clerics from making their laws the violence will slowly but surely decline ....just cant buy that Lux ?
 
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