It appears the odds have been dropping on Kessler and I'm a little surprised. IMO he should be the solid favorite. I wouldn't quite call him an elite fighter but it will practically take an elite fighter to beat him. He's VERY solid in all departments. It took a career performance by Zags to get by him and Zags had to dig deep for it. Is Ward on that level? With nobody other than Miranda on his resume, I'm just hard pressed to see him winning. Not an easy fight for Kessler by any stretch but I believe with his experience, perseverence and skill set he'll win a dec 116-113 variety. I took Kessler @-185.
Kessler/Ward
- Thread starter Romi
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- Apr 8, 2008
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Sensible! Kessler the real deal and he may have been compromised with a left mitt injury against Calzaghe. Ward has a tall order against a guy that does everything from good to excellent. Kessler in physical prime and has faced, and beaten, much better. Anyone that can shut out tough guy Andrade has to have something special. I certainly don't think Ward would have it that easy with the Caveman, if he could get by him at all. Kessler by late KO.
huge kessler fan here...but andrade and ward are stylistic opposites.....
personally,i don`t think you can draw any conclusions from kessler shutting out a talent compromised tough-man like andrade and a quick slickster with an amateur pedigree like ward.....
the better comparison would be calzaghe,imo.....
personally,i don`t think you can draw any conclusions from kessler shutting out a talent compromised tough-man like andrade and a quick slickster with an amateur pedigree like ward.....
the better comparison would be calzaghe,imo.....
- Apr 8, 2008
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Weasel, I was just saying that handling a guy like Andrade with the aplomb Kessler showed is impressive. And I don't think Ward could do it the same way, if at all. I understand completely how they are different. And I really don't see anyone mimicking Calzaghe, certainly not Ward.
i thought bute handled andrade with aplomb(for 11 3/4 rounds)...lol...
i`m not picking ward(not right now)......but the guy brings a totally different style than anything kessler`s used to seeing in europe....
he`s undefeated since 1996 with a 105-5 amateur record...
he`s just as tall...and fighting at home....
this is not some guy kessler`s going to clown(like the limited andrade) ...
i`d be very careful here...very careful...
maybe take your kessler shot with a ward via decision hedge...:shrug:
- Apr 8, 2008
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Both Andre's are talents for sure but there may be a certain substance missing with both of them that will keep them from being truly great. I thought Andrade did much better against Bute than Kessler, not including the late KO. Andrade touched Lucien quite a bit throughout the fight even though he lost most of the rounds. But he layed nary a glove on the Great Dane.
Like Kessler a lot in this spot. Ward doesn't have too much pop on his shots and I think Kessler is a very accurate puncher. If odds keep dropping I like it even more.
you may be right....but,when you get a chance re-watch kessler vs calzaghe...not saying that ward is calzaghe...calzaghe made me a believer....he`s a true great....
his movement...feints...and punches from odd angles confused the hell out of kessler...he actually was backing kessler up(which ward won`t be able to do)...
imo,he had kessler thoroughly beaten(mentally) by around the 9th....it wasn`t close,imo...i didn`t think it was all that competitive...
ward is sloppy compared to joe...he`s not calzaghe...but he brings some similar skills to the table...and although fairly athletic,kessler is a european style fighter..straight up and down and repititious in that most of his arsenal consists of the jab/right hand...the one/two...
but,granted,,,he does it damn well..that jab is a toughie...
i`m just worried that ward`s quickness and awkwardness will cause problems....you know he and his people have gone over calzaghe/kessler with a fine tooth comb..
maybe kessler`s just too strong...in another class...
but ward`s quicks and style/home court/and not knowing how to lose...all scare me...thats all i`m saying...
Seeing as how this is the hurt business, I think Dirrell might have been able to beat Froch if he could crack a bit. I don't see too much pop with Ward but I think Kessler's power will be evident. I'm going to find the best line in Vegas and hammer it.
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I am with you on this one Garden. I love Kessler but this could be a tough match for him.
I don't think it was Joe's power that bothered Kessler (Although he did land a murderous bodyshot at one point) but his quickness and punch output.
Ward might have the skill to follow that type of blueprint.
I am staying well away from this one.
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glad you agree,brother...at the moment i lean kessler...but,i`m still looking...scares me...
wee...i thought joe`s performance vs kessler(who we all know is really,really good..world class and then some),should be put in a time capsule.....
it was that good....a masterpiece...it`s almost like calzaghe has a 6th sense about how to approach opponents he`s never been in with...and he can shift gears at a moment`s notice.....he`s not locked into one style...he finds a way to win...
a white guy that even black guys with insane fast twitch muscles/coordination and reflexes can`t figure out...
obviously,i`ve become a calzaghe fan...how could i not?...
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Ward don't have Calzaghe's chin and has been hurt by way lesser guys. He's sloppy at times and has no power. I really don't see a comparison between Ward and Calzaghe to be honest. This is a monsterous step up for Ward and I think he losses. I took kessler at -170 among othe numbers.
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Ward don't have Calzaghe's chin and has been hurt by way lesser guys. He's sloppy at times and has no power. I really don't see a comparison between Ward and Calzaghe to be honest. This is a monsterous step up for Ward and I think he losses. I took kessler at -170 among othe numbers.
At first I tought Kessler would easily take it, and frankly, I'm a bit surprised that Ward is only a 2-1 dog!
But Ward has some skills and he is fighting at home.
I'm also curious to see how Ward takes Kesslers puches, Ward has been hurt before and Kessler can punch. As for Ward, I think his chance to win by ko is pretty slim.
I dont know, IMO Ward and Calzaghe have different styles, both are quick, but I think it was more Calzahges ability to adapt and his will as well as his athleticism that won him the fight against Kessler. Ward has speed and technique but I dont know about the rest.
But Ward has some skills and he is fighting at home.
I'm also curious to see how Ward takes Kesslers puches, Ward has been hurt before and Kessler can punch. As for Ward, I think his chance to win by ko is pretty slim.
I dont know, IMO Ward and Calzaghe have different styles, both are quick, but I think it was more Calzahges ability to adapt and his will as well as his athleticism that won him the fight against Kessler. Ward has speed and technique but I dont know about the rest.
Agreed. Kessler was landing some missiles on Zags and ZAgs showed incredible heart to recover and turn it up a notch to turn the tide. I haven't seen those qualities in Ward. Ward also doesn't have the high volume output of Zags. Ward will need a masterful A+ performance to pull this off. I see it close early and Kessler pulling away in the 2nd half. I couldn't resist -170 and hit it again. Ill be at the fight so hopefully there will be a few good undercard fights. Boxrec has nothing on tap so far. I'm REALLY looking forward to this scrap!
didn`t say ward would beat kessler...i said as of right now i favor kessler.....just saying it`s a style that could cause him some problems....that,and the the intangibles(home court/equal height/hasn`t lost in 13 years)...
i was perfectly clear that ward was no calzaghe....and i said he couldn`t back kessler up(which joe did).....
i was just commenting that this caliber speed(and yes,ward is faster than mundine,who has beaten exactly nobody..mundine lost at home to manny f-cking siaca and got stopped by sven ottke) is not something that kessler has big experience dealing with in europe...
could he walk through ward?...sure he could...but miranda couldn`t...yes,i know miranda`s no kessler......but there are enough red flags there(for me) to give a guy pause...
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Not much new to offer, just some agreement with weepaul and the weasel. Forced to choose, I'd have to go with Kessler, who is the proven real deal...but there are some intangibles here which give me cause to stay away.
We really don't know how good Ward is yet. After a shaky start to his career, he has really seemed to turn it up a couple of notches. Miranda fight was easy for him, and I get the impression he's improving quick. Also homefield for Ward. Combine that with Kessler's relative inactivity since the Calzaghe fight - which may have burst the Dane's bubble just a bit - and I think I will stay away.
We really don't know how good Ward is yet. After a shaky start to his career, he has really seemed to turn it up a couple of notches. Miranda fight was easy for him, and I get the impression he's improving quick. Also homefield for Ward. Combine that with Kessler's relative inactivity since the Calzaghe fight - which may have burst the Dane's bubble just a bit - and I think I will stay away.
Once again I agree with everything my pal has just said.
I think Kessler should win BUT he is fighting away from home against a speedy boxer.
As Ghost pointed out, Kessler is far more skilled than the usual 1-2 European boxer, but I think this might be his most difficult fight of this comp and that includes Abraham.
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- Nov 14, 2008
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I'm on Valuev @ +180.
With right plan Haye wins this but I can't overlook + odds on Valuev in Germany against unproven HW with smelly beard.
With right plan Haye wins this but I can't overlook + odds on Valuev in Germany against unproven HW with smelly beard.