Paq-DeLaHoya- I love this

gardenweasel

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"the bunker"
i sympathize with you, friend.

this is one of those nights where you reconsider your competence, and your chosen path in life. maybe its not worth it. im in the -ve for the first time ever. hundreds of hours 'down the shitter' as weepaul said, and what did it amount to?

youre a good man and i hope you rebound. i already have wager on torres/holt, but i think that's it for a while. we made jokes about the squeegees, but i put myself in serious trouble tonight, and i lost. i always said a man has to 'take his shot' in life when hes confident in himself, well tongiht i was confident in myself, and i lost it all. i lost it bad.

i hope things turn around for you. i need a break.

bro,i`m fine...i`m financially well off,so to speak....i don`t mean rich...but ithis isn`t some life altering event for me....

i feel for you,as a struggling student,who obviously has to watch his p`s and q`s....

i hope this didn`t create some enormous hardship for you...

i`m more embarrassed and disappointed for pointing friends in the wrong direction...

that hurts...

i hope everyone bets within their means....this is an object lesson for the few that don`t....

this is without a doubt the worse psychological boxing-wager loss i`ve experienced.....i wasn`t even in the ballpark...


.and from the sound of it,i may not be alone...lol

as gamblers....i guess we all realize that this is gonna happen...you live long enough and your prostate`s gonna kick you in the ass at some point...

i guess the lesson is that money mgmt is a must...because the law of averages kicks everyone in the shins at some point in their gambling career..
 
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gardenweasel

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"the bunker"
this brightened my mood a bit....

a guy on another forum said that being as the pacquaio thing didn`t go so well,that oscar was angling for "another" farewell fight vs ivan calderon.....

now that`s funny...
 

Zerwas

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hey guys, I'm really sorry for your losses, I thought Manny would be competitive?.well, in fact, I couldn?t get a clear picture and didn?t bet much anyway?but I certainly didn?t expect that kind of dominant performance by Manny.

I was going to write to be careful with this fight, but I didn?t know what to think with so many knowledgeable guys backing Oscar?.

This really reminds me of my first huge bet on Lewis against Rahman (first fight)?great choice that was to pick exactly the most shocking loss in recent history back then?I lost about 3 k?or even more and I ve already pushed it to the back of my mind ;-)?.I was absolutely shocked?I called everything that I did into question and even comtemplated quitting?I picked Lewis by ko in the rematch and slowly build up my bankroll again?today I see this as a valuable learning experience?

Even though I have built up my bankroll since then, I never bet the same amount again?the profits of the year or a substantial part of it riding on one fight will always be dangerous?I certainly stay away from that?.

Well, bros, I think you can rebuild your bankroll?I guess this loss is more about money management than about knowledge on boxing and you certainly have the latter?

Congrats to Evan, seems like he had a really good night?damn, I should have followed his advice, I usually do?anyways, I too lost some bucks this week, I think I have got to be a little more selective with my picks?

After all, I tend to believe that it might after all be harder to come down in weight than to move up?history certainly tells u that its rarely be done (successfully)?

Take care!
 

Ghost Kid

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Excellent post Zerwas

When something this shocking happens, everyone begins to question

most of the people I know who cashed on Manny don't really watch boxing that much...maybe a little distance helped...who knows

We're we all too "knowledgable" on this one? Information overkill? I am certainly not easily swayed...I am strong on my opinions and will write when i disagree with the board...but I agreed with everything i read here the last few weeks...

the majority here (and all the other boards) were on Oscar LARGE

I had a crapload of money on the Ortiz under-it softens this blow a bit...but it has been a difficult few weeks

Sorry NJ, Wee, Crow, Weasel

great great cappers and great contributors here

F U Oscar De La Puta....thanks for ruining Christmas for all the madjack boys!

Good riddance

Let's come back swinging next week guys....don't let De La Puta ruin the clan....
 

Ghost Kid

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So many times i've bet against Hoya and lost. For the one time i chose him he doesn't show up.

If i knew Hoya was going to be 147 on fight night i would never have bet.

Pac by ko was +800.

As Roach predicted so well: " Hoya will know how chavez felt.".

I feel ya bro

the one god damn time I bet on this jerkoff

I've hated this phony for years....should have known he would find a way to screw me again..

what an embarrassing performance....really damages the legacy

oh, who am i kidding? what legacy? Oscar is WITHOUT QUESTION one of the most over-rated prize fighters in the history of this great sport

As Atlas said...."He has screwed up every big fight he has ever been in"

Good Lord, i am quoting Teddy...gotta go to bed now...

peace fellas
 

THE KOD

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any chance that at some point oscar throws caution to te wind and goes for broke?...

his legacy is crushed if he loses in the manner you guys are describing...

............................................................

yeh dlh legacy is crushed as he is going to retire making 22 million on this fight.

you guys should know better about old ass fighters nearing retirement.
 

crow

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what an embarrassing performance....really damages the legacy

oh, who am i kidding? what legacy? Oscar is WITHOUT QUESTION one of the most over-rated prize fighters in the history of this great sport

As Atlas said...."He has screwed up every big fight he has ever been in"

Good Lord, i am quoting Teddy...gotta go to bed now...

peace fellas

Right on.
His performance was pathetic. It was the mother of all meltdowns.
When i first heard he really was 147, i rushed and picked Manny by KO rds 10 to 12 at very big odds, just to cover my ass.

Then after rd 3 placed Manny by dec at bet365; neither my hedges hit.
Depending on how Pac fares in this new division, this loss will make Hoya the biggest phony in boxing for some years to come.

Even Leonard lasted the distance with Norris, a true light middle himself.
Totally outclassed, he was still throwing shots and setting traps for Norris and his pride pushed him not to get stopped.

Hoya understood after 4 rds it wasn't going to be his night and accepted defeat right there, concentrated on defense, refused to throw, and instead of launching a desperate assault waited to be stopped by the officials.

Roach was so right with the Chavez remark. Even he rushed Hoya to try for a desperate KO; he never surrendered until having given his absolute all.

Frigging Larios shook Manny more than Hoya.
I could certainly pick about 50 fighters from super feather to light welter that would have given Pac a better fight.
He was fresh as daisy after 8 rds, his easiest fight EVER, probably . Analysts and fans toegether are going to gloss an Hoya's non performance against a former flyweight for years. I'm not even talking Mexican fans.

I will have to slowly rebuild my bankroll, it might take a few months, but at least i have a few winnings left, that's the consolation part.

This ranks, toegether with the Paul Williams- Quintana 1 fiasco, as one of my worsts bets ever.
 
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weepaul

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I could not agree with you more Crow.

This was my worst bet ever but it stings soo much more that the Fuker did not go down swinging.

To TRY and win a fight, it usually helps to, I don't know, THROW A FUKIN PUNCH!!!!!!
 

punchmaster

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Valero

Valero

This cat spoke the truth ...

http://www.boxingscene.com/?m=show&id=17324

Valero Claims That He Busted De La Hoya Up in Camp

Some very surprising twists in Las Vegas. Former super featherweight champion and current lightweight contender, Edwin Valero (24-0, 24KOs), claims that he busted up Oscar De La Hoya during their sparring session in Big Bear, California. Valero was brought in as a sparring partner to help De La Hoya prepare for Manny Pacquiao. Valero almost lashed out at De La Hoya while speaking to the Philippine Daily Inquirer, claiming that Oscar lied about who gave him a black eye, lied about his level of training and even predicted a knockout win for Pacquiao.

Valero says De La Hoya is the not the hard worker he makes himself out to be. He says that Oscar doesn't like to train. He shot down De La Hoya's story of Victor Ortiz handing him a black eye during a sparring session, and then said that he busted up De La Hoya so bad - it resulted in his removal from the Big Bear training camp.

?Oscar doesn?t like to workout. Oscar doesn?t like to run. Pacquiao is going to knock Oscar out. I was the one who gave Oscar the black eye. Ask him who did it. I got kicked out of Big Bear because of that. I only sparred with Oscar for eight rounds because after those eight rounds, Oscar didn?t want to spar with me anymore. I hurt Oscar a lot,? Valero said.
 

crow

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This cat spoke the truth ...

http://www.boxingscene.com/?m=show&id=17324

Valero Claims That He Busted De La Hoya Up in Camp

Some very surprising twists in Las Vegas. Former super featherweight champion and current lightweight contender, Edwin Valero (24-0, 24KOs), claims that he busted up Oscar De La Hoya during their sparring session in Big Bear, California. Valero was brought in as a sparring partner to help De La Hoya prepare for Manny Pacquiao. Valero almost lashed out at De La Hoya while speaking to the Philippine Daily Inquirer, claiming that Oscar lied about who gave him a black eye, lied about his level of training and even predicted a knockout win for Pacquiao.

Valero says De La Hoya is the not the hard worker he makes himself out to be. He says that Oscar doesn't like to train. He shot down De La Hoya's story of Victor Ortiz handing him a black eye during a sparring session, and then said that he busted up De La Hoya so bad - it resulted in his removal from the Big Bear training camp.

“Oscar doesn’t like to workout. Oscar doesn’t like to run. Pacquiao is going to knock Oscar out. I was the one who gave Oscar the black eye. Ask him who did it. I got kicked out of Big Bear because of that. I only sparred with Oscar for eight rounds because after those eight rounds, Oscar didn’t want to spar with me anymore. I hurt Oscar a lot,” Valero said.

This just demonstrates the difficulty on getting real inside info on training camps.
Surely staff knew Hoya wasn't looking good and wasn't doing the usual routines a fighter goes through.
If Valero said the truth and Hoya wasn't running, why nobody reported it ?
Everybody, from Nancho to Dundee were predicting a sure win for Hoya while knowing damn well he was going to get licked.

Boxing is an insider game; you need to know the right people to ask advice from if you're betting.

If you rely on the media they will send you the wrong path.
 

crow

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Or read between the lines!:0corn

Did you ? :confused:

Look at him.
Pretty no more (small consolation) :eek:

Oscar_50396.jpg
 
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punchmaster

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............................................................

yeh dlh legacy is crushed as he is going to retire making 22 million on this fight.

you guys should know better about old ass fighters nearing retirement.

Scotty boy- nowhere to be found and then you come in and make some wise-ass comment after the fight's over. I recall when you did post some picks and you weren't exactly a winning capper. It says here that you officiallly suck.
 
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frank s.

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Punch; that clown is a first class jerk-off. Lots of people thought DLH had one good fight left in him. They were wrong as was I also. What, that little pecker head is perfect? Never loses a bet? I don't think he ever made a stinkin sports wager!
 

crow

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Yes, I took PacMan.

Well done.


I knew Valero's story beforehand, but chose to believe Angelo Dundee's " i never saw a fighter liking the gym so much as Oscar, apart from Ali" line on the 24/7 series....

The ***"//.%* hypocrite :mad: :cursin: :liar: :banghead:

As did say earlier another member, boxing betting is a shark infested business
 
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Ghost Kid

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Monday now and I am still pissed...

I have been talking with a few people that attended the fight
When Oscar only put on 2 pounds we should have all jumped ship....easier said than done...

Its very difficult to change bets when you have invested so much time, effort and money during the week prior...you question yourself back and forth at the last minute....

The subtle signs can be HUGE if you read them correctly

Graham wrote a great piece this morning (talking about the ringside reaction to Oscar's 2 pound weight gain)...this is why you need internet access at fights!

http://www.fightwriter.com/?q=node/1993

The thing is Oscar has never been in tough bruising battles and should have had more left than that...but he trained like an arrogant a-hole and clearly, after the first round, lost any faith in himself....a pathetic and meager way to leave the sport that has paid him so handsomely...

Congrats Kramden and Zerwas...you guys were on Pac and you were correct
 

Fightwriter

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A lot of people in the industry loved De La Hoya in this fight, people I really respect: matchmakers, agents etc., experienced professionals. The biggest shock, though, is that De La Hoya gave Manny less of a fight than just about anyone in recent memory. Even Erik Morales landed some shots, as I recall, before going out in the third.

Manny players are gloating today (sorry, no other word for it, not many gracious winners out there) and, yes, winning is a very nice feeling, but I think very few of the winners would tell you, hand on heart, that they thought Pacquiao would smack De La Hoya around like a sparring partner.

The fact that some smart people liked Pacquiao (it wasn't Oscar all the way by any means among sharp guys) showed that this wasn't a formality for DLH. I do think there was overconfidence in some of the Oscar plays that got made but, don't get me wrong, I liked Oscar in the fight and I thought that when the odds got to -170 or so that he was good value -- but then, I thought he would be a strong 152, 154 pounds on fight night, and ready to fight. I got that wrong on both counts.

I didn't post a pick here but on my website I had Pacquiao fighting a tremendous fight but getting stopped in 10. As I mentioned in my post-fight wrap today, at least I got the "putting up a tremendous fight" part right!

A very experienced source told me today he believes that De La Hoya was brought down to weight far too early. He said that in this situation the fighter's stomach shrinks and it is not so easy to put fluids and food back into the system because it feels uncomfortable to attempt to do so. This makes some sense to me and would explain why De La Hoya put on only two pounds from the weigh-in to the night of the fight.

Someone else, also very experienced, who had some first-hand knowledge of what was going on at Big Bear, told me that Oscar flat out left his fight in the gym, information I got too late to be of any use.

Kudos to all those who were on the winning side, and look, maybe Manny could have beaten Oscar on the best day that Oscar ever had, but let's be frank, De La Hoya had nothing on Saturday night, and what's more I believe he KNEW he had nothing even before he entered the ring.

Reading between the lines, as Kramden did, can be done, but I didn't crack this particular code.

This was like Fernando Vargas coming into the ring a dead man walking for the rematch with Shane Mosley. Not many would have expected Vargas to be absolutely and utterly unable to compete that night, and I am pretty sure that not even Kramden read between the lines on that one. I'm right on this, aren't I, Kramden?

The thing is, in boxing there is a lot of information but also disinformation floating around, and things are not always what they seem. I think why the Oscar backers are so disappointed is because they felt that their guy didn't at least give them a run for their money. Well, OK, he didn't, but, frankly, I just don't think that De La Hoya had it in him physically to give ANYTHING. He had the look of a man who was thinking: "I'm in it now and I've got to get through it," rather than one who is thinking: "OK, I'm ready to go, let's get to it." Big difference.
 
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Zerwas

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That?s what Oscar said after the fight after Merchant asked him whether he was shocked?
Very revealing!

?I?m not shocked, because, you know...at this stage?you know?if you face a great fighter like Manny ?then?its almost ..expected and?and I trained hard?but like a told people in the gym, it?s a whole different story??

Oscar didnt respond to the question by Larrry Merchant if the weight (loss) affected him, but as Kramden said you can read between the lines...before the interview actually started Merchant overheard him saying to Manny "I did this to myself."
 
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