UFC 123: Rampage vs. Machida Saturday Nov 20th

[The Sponge]

after watching round one again i think Rampage got screwed out of ten body shots he landed when he had Machida against the cage. Foot stomps, Elbows, knees, and body shots. Machida threw about ten kicks. 3 or four were checked and three landed while the others missed. Rampage also landed two punches. machida also landed some knees against the cage.

:00x32

 

[WhatsHisNuts]

after watching round one again i think Rampage got screwed out of ten body shots he landed when he had Machida against the cage. Foot stomps, Elbows, knees, and body shots. Machida threw about ten kicks. 3 or four were checked and three landed while the others missed. Rampage also landed two punches. machida also landed some knees against the cage.

:00x32

Are you serious?

 

[gardenweasel]

after watching round one again i think Rampage got screwed out of ten body shots he landed when he had Machida against the cage. Foot stomps, Elbows, knees, and body shots. Machida threw about ten kicks. 3 or four were checked and three landed while the others missed. Rampage also landed two punches. machida also landed some knees against the cage.

:00x32

it`s ashamed that the 2 neurons that are actually working in your brain are used to control your bodily functions,spongy...

he got screwed out of nothing...apparently those foot stomps won the round over all the kicks and counters machida landed....first time in history that foot stomps won a fighter a round...

ask yourself this,spongy .....how come rua got an immediate rematch with machida?.....yet,machida doesn`t get the same treatment?.....

answer:..dana white

that`s basically all you need to know...

 

[layinwood]

GW, I really don't see it man. I understand people see things from different perspectives but Machida just did nothing in the first to win the round. Maybe Page didn't either but I can't see how you can argue that someone go screwed. Everyone always says not to leave it in the judges hands and if that truely is the case then Machida needs to do more than he did in the first and second. Even you have to admit that.

 

[The Sponge]

it`s ashamed that the 2 neurons that are actually working in your brain are used to control your bodily functions,spongy...

he got screwed out of nothing...apparently those foot stomps won the round over all the kicks and counters machida landed....first time in history that foot stomps won a fighter a round...

ask yourself this,spongy .....how come rua got an immediate rematch with machida?.....yet,machida doesn`t get the same treatment?.....

answer:..dana white

that`s basically all you need to know...

What about the ten body shots Rampage landed in the clinch? Stop talking with ur wallet it is getting embarassing. What counters did Machida land? :shrug: I don't think he threw one punch. Guys who didn't bet the fight have a much different look at it then u do betting the fight. This one sided demolition u see, nobody else does. As for the rematch that has nothing to do with the fight. That part i agree with. It was a close fight. Live with it. Could have went either way.

 

[The Sponge]

Rua screwing with Machida was a lot different than this fight. Not even close.

 

[The Sponge]

Are you serious?

Watch it again. Against the cage not only was Rampage hitting a few foot stomps he landed close to ten body shots. why don't these count? Machida landed about three or four kicks and about three or 4 were checked by Rampage. do these check kicks count as landed? Who the fuk knows. In ufc 122 i don't think takedowns counted in one fight. These judges score fights any way they want. sometimes it is better off not betting the late fights and wait and see how these guys are scoring the early ones. then if they are not counting takedowns i would shy away from the wrestler in the later fight.

 

[gardenweasel]

GW, I really don't see it man. I understand people see things from different perspectives but Machida just did nothing in the first to win the round. Maybe Page didn't either but I can't see how you can argue that someone go screwed. Everyone always says not to leave it in the judges hands and if that truely is the case then Machida needs to do more than he did in the first and second. Even you have to admit that.

don`t agree....i though machida did all the striking in rd 1...rampage held him against the cage...they exchanged some inconsequential knees...rampage had some footstomps...

machida landed some hard kicks and nice counters in actual exchanges ...

when they were actually exchanging,rampage was doing nothing...he hardly laid a glove on machida....that`s whay rampage was attempting to hold him against the fence..he couldn`t catch him...lke a boxer getting out-boxed tries to clinch..

was it an exciting round?...no...but machida out-struck rampage...that`s a fact...


imo,this is all about white steering the ufc in the direction he wants it to go....

cerebral/technical strikers need not apply...would penn have beaten edgar had he clinched him against the cage and stomped his foot?...

i don`t blame machida..i don`t blame rampage.....if you want to really trace this issue of dana trying to control the way fights are fought,you have to go back to anderson silva`s recent fights....

that`s the shitstorm that made thoughtful/chess-match type encounters persona-non-grata in the ufc....

and it`s ashamed...not every fight is "thunderdome" or 'the roman ampitheater".....for me,that`s part of the lure of mma....different styles clashing...it`s not always brute aggression...

remember the "toughman" fights?....where are they now?....that shit gets old....

i`d wager a dollar to a donut that practically everyone that weighed in on this thread thought that going into rd 3,that would decide the fight....they though exactly what rampage thought...

but when it comes to being a fan...or money...objectivity takes a back seat...

i agree with the 3 major internet mma sites rbr assessment of the fight..in real time..and rampage...

sorry...we obviously agree to diasagree..,

so it`s done..i`d like to say that dana`s a hypocrite for denying machida the rematch that he gave rua and penn vs edgar...yes,they were championship fights....but,this was basically an elimination fight to see who gets rua........and white couldn`t stomach another rua vs machida fight....it was a business decision.....

....but saying "dana" and "hypocrite" in the same sentence would be redundant...

 

[The Sponge]

UFC 123 Main Event Breakdown: Rampage vs. Machida By The Numbers
Posted by chrisl on Nov 22, 2010 at 9:17 am ETNo CommentsThere have been many complaints about MMA?s scoring system for years now and Saturday night was just the latest chapter in this ongoing saga.

It seems as though the UFC 123 headliner between Quinton ?Rampage? Jackson and Lyoto Machida has sparked many complaints about a fight being fixed and this seems to be because many believe Machida won the fight and because of Rampage?s exclamation that ?Machida whipped my ass tonight.?

With that said let us look at the fight by the numbers provided by FightMetric.com:

Round 1: The fight metric scoring system scores the round for Rampage due to Rampage outstriking Lyoto 26-16 and zero grappling attempts by either fighter. Using the 10-point must system, this leads to a 10-9 round for Rampage.

Round 2: Fight metric scores the round 31-27 under their formula for Rampage, because he outstrikes Machida 28-11 and took Machida down while stuffing Machida?s takedown attempt. That said, Machida?s strikes were almost all power shots, which allowed him keep the round close. However, 31-27 is too close of a round under their formula (due to reasonable standard of error) so the round is given to neither fighter. This results in a 10-10 round.

Round 3: This round was a definitive round for Machida. Machida outstruck Rampage 26-16, landed a takedown, and then attempted an armbar, resulting in the round being given to Machida 10-9 and a 29-29 draw (which is also what MMAFrenzy.com scored the fight live)

Analysis: In the end, the bout went to a draw by the numbers. When you look at the total number of strikes landed Rampage lands 70 to Machida?s 53, but Machida won the significant strikes battle 33-16, which are not easy to judge in person. Rampage stopped two takedowns and gave up one to Machida, while Machida gave up one to Rampage. This made it so the takedown game favored Rampage due to the successful blocks. In addition, Machida attempted the only submission of the night with the third round armbar attempt. So it is easy to see how this fight could be a draw looking at it as a whole.

So why are there complaints about the Machida-Rampage fight being fixed? This could be attributed to something called the ?recency effect.? The recency effect is a psychology term used to describe the fact that people remember the end of something more so than the middle. So basically, since the third round was a very decisive round in a fight marked by two close rounds early, people will be more apt to name Machida the ?clear? winner. In reality, the numbers favored Rampage in each of the first two rounds (albeit the second was not a significant margin), which means it is easy to see how Machida lost two rounds to one. The recency effect also explains Rampage?s reaction at the end of the bout as well.

Ultimately, it is the perceptions of the three people who are at three different positions around the octagon and turn in their scores at the end of each round. I place special emphasis on ?the end of each round,? because judges do not look at the entire fight and then decide how to score each round nor are their cards there in front of them to change a previous round later. I try this method when I watch fights at home and in all honesty, I was shocked by how much different things seem when you try it this way. That said, in a 10-point MUST system, judges seem to already be primed that they MUST award a winner of a round. This can discourage a judge from giving a 10-10 score in a round no matter how close it is. So at this point, it comes back to what the judges see. This presents a problem for a fighter who fights a more passive style, like Machida, in two of the first three rounds because aggression counts for a lot in a closely fought bout.

In the end, if anyone unfairly set the scales against a fighter in this bout it was Machida sabotaging himself, not some judging conspiracy

 

[The Sponge]

I will tell ya one fight i thought might have smelled was the Harris fight. Harris was getting choked out in the first round and then the ten second noise went off. All of the sudden in three seconds the horn goes off with seven seconds remaining:shrug: . Harris got saved because no way he would have survived the next seven seconds. Everyone was yelling about his opponent holding on to the choked to long but the guy got ripped off. What a disappointment Harris was. What he was doing with his hands i'll never know. I totally over evaluated him. I don't remember him fighting like that and if i knew the other guy trained at Chutebox i would have never bet Harris. I deserved to lose that one.

 

[layinwood]

when they were actually exchanging,rampage was doing nothing...he hardly laid a glove on machida....that`s whay rampage was attempting to hold him against the fence..he couldn`t catch him...lke a boxer getting out-boxed tries to clinch..

quote]


You act like him holding him against the cage and stomping on his feet, knees and body blows(don't actually think you brought those punches up) is a bad thing. When someone runs constantly you have to hold them like this. It's mma not boxing. When Randy does it to guys it's great but when Page did it to Machida it's because he couldn't catch him.

I've watched the first round over and over now and I just can't see your complaint Wease. I wouldn't have minded Machida winning because he would get the winner of Bader and Jones and the fight I want to see right now is Jones vs Machida but he didn't win the round. The fight was close and could have gone either way based on scoring but you're acting like it was a tragic screw job and it wasn't.

 

[Ghost Kid]

I will tell ya one fight i thought might have smelled was the Harris fight. Harris was getting choked out in the first round and then the ten second noise went off. All of the sudden in three seconds the horn goes off with seven seconds remaining:shrug: . Harris got saved because no way he would have survived the next seven seconds. Everyone was yelling about his opponent holding on to the choked to long but the guy got ripped off. What a disappointment Harris was. What he was doing with his hands i'll never know. I totally over evaluated him. I don't remember him fighting like that and if i knew the other guy trained at Chutebox i would have never bet Harris. I deserved to lose that one.

This is so true Sponge and NO ONE is talking about this fight....the bell CLEARLY rang early to end round 1....

I'm not too pleased about it, because I had a flyer on "Falcao wins round 1"

No question, Harris was going out cold, and someone decided to ring that thing early
:nono:

From Tomas Rios homepage:

"# For those of you asking, the bell to end the 1st round of Harris/Falcao went off about 6 seconds early.
The 1st round ending six seconds early is a big deal that is being overshadowed by the main event. A deadly serious error. "

 

[The Sponge]

This is so true Sponge and NO ONE is talking about this fight....the bell CLEARLY rang early to end round 1....

I'm not too pleased about it, because I had a flyer on "Falcao wins round 1"

No question, Harris was going out cold, and someone decided to ring that thing early
:nono:

From Tomas Rios homepage:

"# For those of you asking, the bell to end the 1st round of Harris/Falcao went off about 6 seconds early.
The 1st round ending six seconds early is a big deal that is being overshadowed by the main event. A deadly serious error. "

boy that sucks ghost u got robbed cause he was almost out cold and would have been if the right time was used. I watched the fights sunday and could only get the third round until later in the night when i got the whole fight. I was wondering why u guys didn't say anything the night of the fight. I had to rewind it cause i was wondering what the heck was happening. I thought the clock was wrong on the tape i was watching. i wish i could find the Brown/Foster fight. I missed that one.

 

[Ghost Kid]

boy that sucks ghost u got robbed cause he was almost out cold and would have been if the right time was used. I watched the fights sunday and could only get the third round until later in the night when i got the whole fight. I was wondering why u guys didn't say anything the night of the fight. I had to rewind it cause i was wondering what the heck was happening. I thought the clock was wrong on the tape i was watching. i wish i could find the Brown/Foster fight. I missed that one.

Like you I didn't watch this full fight till Sunday.

The Martinez-Williams boxing match was happening at the exact same time as the Harris-Falcao match.

As soon as Martinez KO'ed Williams in round 2, I turned back to the UFC card.

But I don't know why no one else on the boards said anything about this?
:shrug:

Those who had Falcao round 1 (+800) were ROBBED !

 

[Ghost Kid]

Early End to First Round Cost Maiquel Falcao at UFC 123

Early End to First Round Cost Maiquel Falcao at UFC 123

Early End to First Round Cost Maiquel Falcao at UFC 123
http://www.mmafighting.com/2010/11/22/early-end-to-first-round-cost-maiquel-falcao-at-ufc-123/

 

[gardenweasel]

UFC 123 Main Event Breakdown: Rampage vs. Machida By The Numbers
Posted by chrisl on Nov 22, 2010 at 9:17 am ETNo CommentsThere have been many complaints about MMA?s scoring system for years now and Saturday night was just the latest chapter in this ongoing saga.

It seems as though the UFC 123 headliner between Quinton ?Rampage? Jackson and Lyoto Machida has sparked many complaints about a fight being fixed and this seems to be because many believe Machida won the fight and because of Rampage?s exclamation that ?Machida whipped my ass tonight.?

With that said let us look at the fight by the numbers provided by FightMetric.com:

Round 1: The fight metric scoring system scores the round for Rampage due to Rampage outstriking Lyoto 26-16 and zero grappling attempts by either fighter. Using the 10-point must system, this leads to a 10-9 round for Rampage.

Round 2: Fight metric scores the round 31-27 under their formula for Rampage, because he outstrikes Machida 28-11 and took Machida down while stuffing Machida?s takedown attempt. That said, Machida?s strikes were almost all power shots, which allowed him keep the round close. However, 31-27 is too close of a round under their formula (due to reasonable standard of error) so the round is given to neither fighter. This results in a 10-10 round.

Round 3: This round was a definitive round for Machida. Machida outstruck Rampage 26-16, landed a takedown, and then attempted an armbar, resulting in the round being given to Machida 10-9 and a 29-29 draw (which is also what MMAFrenzy.com scored the fight live)

Analysis: In the end, the bout went to a draw by the numbers. When you look at the total number of strikes landed Rampage lands 70 to Machida?s 53, but Machida won the significant strikes battle 33-16, which are not easy to judge in person. Rampage stopped two takedowns and gave up one to Machida, while Machida gave up one to Rampage. This made it so the takedown game favored Rampage due to the successful blocks. In addition, Machida attempted the only submission of the night with the third round armbar attempt. So it is easy to see how this fight could be a draw looking at it as a whole.

So why are there complaints about the Machida-Rampage fight being fixed? This could be attributed to something called the ?recency effect.? The recency effect is a psychology term used to describe the fact that people remember the end of something more so than the middle. So basically, since the third round was a very decisive round in a fight marked by two close rounds early, people will be more apt to name Machida the ?clear? winner. In reality, the numbers favored Rampage in each of the first two rounds (albeit the second was not a significant margin), which means it is easy to see how Machida lost two rounds to one. The recency effect also explains Rampage?s reaction at the end of the bout as well.

Ultimately, it is the perceptions of the three people who are at three different positions around the octagon and turn in their scores at the end of each round. I place special emphasis on ?the end of each round,? because judges do not look at the entire fight and then decide how to score each round nor are their cards there in front of them to change a previous round later. I try this method when I watch fights at home and in all honesty, I was shocked by how much different things seem when you try it this way. That said, in a 10-point MUST system, judges seem to already be primed that they MUST award a winner of a round. This can discourage a judge from giving a 10-10 score in a round no matter how close it is. So at this point, it comes back to what the judges see. This presents a problem for a fighter who fights a more passive style, like Machida, in two of the first three rounds because aggression counts for a lot in a closely fought bout.

In the end, if anyone unfairly set the scales against a fighter in this bout it was Machida sabotaging himself, not some judging conspiracy

wtf is "fightmetric'?...and who the hell is chrisl?....lol ..if it`s anything like "punchstat" in boxing,spongy,i`m gonna laugh you right out of the forum.....

if jackson landed 26 strikes(not counting footstomps or pitty pat garbage along the cage in a clinch),i`ll eat my hat....

"fightmetric" is counting strikes along the fence with little or no leverage as much as full leg kicks with real torque on them?...

and it had the second round as a draw?...a round that jackson actually won?...

are you serious?...

"fight metric"?...gimme a break....:0002

one thing i think we can all agree on...barboza is gonna be fun to watch down the road..

 

[The Sponge]

Like you I didn't watch this full fight till Sunday.

The Martinez-Williams boxing match was happening at the exact same time as the Harris-Falcao match.

As soon as Martinez KO'ed Williams in round 2, I turned back to the UFC card.
But I don't know why no one else on the boards said anything about this?
:shrug:

Those who had Falcao round 1 (+800) were ROBBED !

:mj07: i didn't get to see the boxing match yet and have stayed far away from any results until now. Thanks ghost :facepalm:

 

[The Sponge]

wtf is "fightmetric'?...and who the hell is chrisl?....lol ..if it`s anything like "punchstat" in boxing,spongy,i`m gonna laugh you right out of the forum.....

..

u are an MMA fan and don't know who Crisl is?

Kickserv brotherin law. He works for Showdown Joe

 

[Ghost Kid]

:mj07: i didn't get to see the boxing match yet and have stayed far away from any results until now. Thanks ghost :facepalm:

:facepalm:


MY BAD

 

[The Sponge]

:facepalm:


MY BAD

At least i don't have to drag my recyliner in my office thinking it is gonna go twelve rounds. ah its no big deal. Im surprised i dodged the result this long. :142smilie